1. cardfan's Avatar
    So after reading many concerns of the 700p owners and what Palm may or may not do by the end of the month (or the 755p in May), what do you guys think of the Iphone.

    I think it could be pretty cool with wifi and bt that works. The screen is very nice and i like the motion detection. The features more than likely will work and not crash on you. Here's what i don't like though..

    First problem for me is carrier. I'm married to Sprint.

    Second, is the 3rd party apps. I can make my Treo do what i want. Iphone won't record video or voice, and i doubt i'll be able to tether it to laptop. No java on safari from what i've read. Games might be lacking, but are rumored to be available on iphone. Not sure if Iphone will have ability to open docs, spreadsheets, etc.

    Third, its all touch screen. Treo still is much easier to use one hand.

    Forth, everyone and their mother will want or own an IPhone. If everyone has one, its not so cool..lol

    They address the above problems, i'm probably leaving the Palm party. But it would be awhile til Apple brings out the improved version.

    Problems with Palm: I will NEVER pay 500 again for something that doesn't get updates. I dug in the wallet on the Treo 300, the 600, and now the 700p. Each experience was worse than before.

    Buy a 755p? Are you nuts? I'd be thankful if they just worked the bugs out in the 700p. Still, to hear they have a 755p coming out when they haven't ever released an update for the 700p. Man...i'm wondering how much longer Palm will be around..
    03-20-2007 02:02 PM
  2. haroldo's Avatar
    Palm might be acquired by the end of the month
    As far as the iPhone is concerned, I can't imaging typing anything on a touch screen. I never type on the Treo's touch screen (onscreen dialing).
    I think once the "WOW" factor wears off, the iPhone will be a status symbol for the young people, but I don't think it can be a workhorse unit for people who need to type in a lot of data. I'm not saying Treos are perfect, but I don't think the iPhone is competing for the same customer as the Treo.
    I could be wrong, usually am, but that is how I see it.
    03-20-2007 02:44 PM
  3. e2chris's Avatar
    This has been a recording.
    03-20-2007 02:55 PM
  4. digipax's Avatar
    Apples customer service is much worse than any other company I've ever worked with.

    The IPhone like the Ipod does not have a user replacable battery, and does anyone remembers the class action lawsuit that it took to even get Apple to address the issue?

    Yea I'll jump right on the I need an Apple bandwagon.
    03-20-2007 04:00 PM
  5. cardfan's Avatar
    I really don't give a crap about the Mac/Windows thing (i only use windows) or if Apple is crap customer service. I mean c'mon, don't tell me you actually called customer service about Treos other than to activate one or get a better plan.

    This is basically a thread for Treo owners to give their thoughts on the phone. Battery can't be replaced? It's a gripe..but a small one. I think the Treo 300 was the same way and i managed. Heck, i manage just fine with one battery for the 700p.
    03-20-2007 04:19 PM
  6. jimmarako's Avatar
    I haven't really researched this in depth, but to me the iPhone does not really appear to for "power users" that a Treo or other MS WinMobile phones are designed for. With that said I am far from a power user..... I only use about 20% of the functionality of my Treo, so while the iPhone would have certain advantages, I'd still stick with the Treo even if I had the choice up front.

    iPhone Problems:
    Can't replace the battery. Most people may not care, but batteries do die then what? With Treo $30 and you on your way. iPone?? $500 brick Also many power users here have larger or multiple batteries.

    No expansion. Sure 8GB is more than most will need, but with Treo I can carry 20, 30, 40GB of memory... my choice

    No apps. I actually like Docs-2-go and use it often. I also find myself after only 3 months of owning a treo trying to control myself from buying all kinds of games, apps, utilities. I'd probably not miss it if I couldn't, but the options are there.

    No email. I think you can only get web-mail (yahoo, gmail, Aol,..) Kiss business users goodbye. That fancy email they demoed...that was Cingular email I think. Do any of you actually use the Sprint/Verizon/Cingular email account the carriers give you?

    If Apple clamps down on accessories expect them to be more expensive.... no ebay specials: $5 for a car charge, headset and wall charger.

    No EVDO/3G. Sure future models may have it, but then your battery life, and/or "super sleek" form factor will have to give. That is the laws of physics.

    No keypad? You decide. I like the "thumb" pad form factor of the Treo (one hand operation). And since most Blackberries, Q's, other smartphone, all have "copied" the Treo form factor, that must say something about it.

    iPhone pluses:
    Much nicer screen. Pretty obvious.

    Cleary its an iPod first, a phone second, so it will smoke anything in music playback,video playback, etc....

    Working wi-fi... how nice. I don't have a data plan yet ($40!!!). Since I'm at work or home 95% of the time with free wi-fi I wish the treo had wi-fi.

    The Apple bundle/appeal. Most people are not geeks. Like the iPod's success, if you get a phone that covers 80% of people's needs, wrapped up in a nice package, it should sell. Every review I've read on the iPod's points out that almost all other MP3 players are cheaper and more feature rich. That scroll wheel and I guess iTunes tip the balance.

    So as another user said I see the younger people who really just want a wide screen iPod, IM, their 15 gmail accounts, and some minimal PDA functions to be happy with this.

    My 2 cents.

    JM
    03-20-2007 07:30 PM
  7. Chazzan's Avatar
    I haven't really researched this in depth, but to me the iPhone does not really appear to for "power users" that a Treo or other MS WinMobile phones are designed for. With that said I am far from a power user..... I only use about 20% of the functionality of my Treo, so while the iPhone would have certain advantages, I'd still stick with the Treo even if I had the choice up front.

    iPhone Problems:
    Can't replace the battery. Most people may not care, but batteries do die then what? With Treo $30 and you on your way. iPone?? $500 brick Also many power users here have larger or multiple batteries.

    No expansion. Sure 8GB is more than most will need, but with Treo I can carry 20, 30, 40GB of memory... my choice

    No apps. I actually like Docs-2-go and use it often. I also find myself after only 3 months of owning a treo trying to control myself from buying all kinds of games, apps, utilities. I'd probably not miss it if I couldn't, but the options are there.

    No email. I think you can only get web-mail (yahoo, gmail, Aol,..) Kiss business users goodbye. That fancy email they demoed...that was Cingular email I think. Do any of you actually use the Sprint/Verizon/Cingular email account the carriers give you?

    If Apple clamps down on accessories expect them to be more expensive.... no ebay specials: $5 for a car charge, headset and wall charger.

    No EVDO/3G. Sure future models may have it, but then your battery life, and/or "super sleek" form factor will have to give. That is the laws of physics.

    No keypad? You decide. I like the "thumb" pad form factor of the Treo (one hand operation). And since most Blackberries, Q's, other smartphone, all have "copied" the Treo form factor, that must say something about it.

    iPhone pluses:
    Much nicer screen. Pretty obvious.

    Cleary its an iPod first, a phone second, so it will smoke anything in music playback,video playback, etc....

    Working wi-fi... how nice. I don't have a data plan yet ($40!!!). Since I'm at work or home 95% of the time with free wi-fi I wish the treo had wi-fi.

    The Apple bundle/appeal. Most people are not geeks. Like the iPod's success, if you get a phone that covers 80% of people's needs, wrapped up in a nice package, it should sell. Every review I've read on the iPod's points out that almost all other MP3 players are cheaper and more feature rich. That scroll wheel and I guess iTunes tip the balance.

    So as another user said I see the younger people who really just want a wide screen iPod, IM, their 15 gmail accounts, and some minimal PDA functions to be happy with this.

    My 2 cents.

    JM
    1.Guarantee you there will be battery replacements like with the ipods in time to replace a drained one.

    2.The email app is not cingular mail. I'm not even going to explain this.

    3.40gb of memory expansion on the treo? what crack are you smoking?

    4.3rd party apps are an inevitability. Steve Jobs indicated mainly that apple would be very careful in introducing these so the iphone doesn't become as unstable as my favorite piece of crap: treo 700p

    5.There will be ebay specials. you can get anything on ebay. it will only take a bit of time. so many of the treo accessories I purchased have been pure crap.

    6.I type A LOT on the treo and it's not a dream at all. the iphone is designed for finger input so comparing finger input like dialpad on a treo is futile. Sure, we'll never know until we try it but with apple design, ingenuity, auto correction and the possibility of typing in landscape mode I truly believe that typing will be at least as easy as on the tiny buttons of a treo.

    7.lack of 3g sucks. I totally agree. but wifi inclusion is great. I can already think of 6 places where I'll be able to use this wifi and get a faster connection than evdo. Besides, Steve Jobs said that 3g will be out soon, so if you really don't want edge, just wait.

    8.I also guarantee that apple WILL do something vis a vis docs. Apple in it's keynote for iphone directly attacked smartphones and treo's, they HAVE to provide document editing functionality to compete. It may not be there when it's released but it WILL be there. I'd put money on it.

    9.Better bluetooth. 2.0

    10.integration with itunes will be amazing. synching contacts, calendars, songs, ringtones, photos, etc through itunes will be drastically easier than palm desktop and it's ineffective conduit system. I can't wait.

    So am I getting an iphone? Definitely. Do I think it's not for power users? I consider myself a power user. Sure, there will be some 3rd party apps that I'll miss but I strongly believe that apps will come and they will be found on the itunes store. I'm really looking forward to it.
    03-20-2007 08:22 PM
  8. jimmarako's Avatar
    OK, well I guess I "took the bait". Being new at this I should still have seen the warning signs. I'm no Treo whipping boy, and actually like Apple as a company (Back to my old Apple //e). Apple for me has been missing the mark since those early days. I imagine this thread will be moved to the iphone section as it should.

    1.Guarantee you there will be battery replacements like with the ipods in time to replace a drained one.
    I'm sure there will. There is a big difference being able to pop in a new battery when needed (daily, weekly,..) and ripping apart a $500 phone. Almost no one will actually pull out the knife and wrench needed to replace their battery on the road.

    2.The email app is not cingular mail. I'm not even going to explain this.
    Sorry, I mistook the Cingular voice mail demo for email. Voicemail features seem nice, but I delete my voice mail as soon as I get it... no good to me. I'll let others address any shortcomings of the Apple email (no VPN yet..)

    3.40gb of memory expansion on the treo? what crack are you smoking?
    Funny, I don't remember insulting you in my reply... I currently have a 8GB SD card in my Treo. No reason future 32GB's won't work. Mutiple cards = Many GB's When/if the SD people get past their 32GB limit will Treo support it? Who knows, but iPhone will still be stuck at 8GB.

    4.3rd party apps are an inevitability. Steve Jobs indicated mainly that apple would be very careful in introducing these so the iphone doesn't become as unstable as my favorite piece of crap: treo 700p
    Of the 100's of Treo/Palm apps probably only a few dozen are useful to most people, so your right, having few 3rd party apps is not necessarily a bad thing. I will say that if installing 3rd party apps makes your Treo unstable, well that is not Palm's fault... it is your fault and the fault of the app writer. Well see once the "non-approved" iPhone apps show up how unstable the iPhone becomes.

    5.There will be ebay specials. you can get anything on ebay. it will only take a bit of time. so many of the treo accessories I purchased have been pure crap.
    I did not realize the amount of iPod accessories on Ebay. I thought Apple kept a lid on that kind of stuff. So iPhone stuff will be as readily available. BTW, again don't blame Palm if you got "crappy" Treo accessories. What makes you think iPhone accessories will be any better since they will be made by the same people?

    6.I type A LOT on the treo and it's not a dream at all...
    Since the iPhone virtual keyboard will be no larger than the Treo's it will probably be harder to type on due to lack of feel. We won't know until the iPhones are reviewed. If your a text junkie then yes the Treo keyboard could be limiting.. you really need one of those phone were the keyboard "slides out" sideway so you can type with two thumbs.

    7.lack of 3g sucks. I totally agree. but wifi inclusion is great...
    I agree... wi-fi is nice. Again, no magic here though... if iPhone gets 3G it is either going to have to get bigger, or face battery shortages.

    8.I also guarantee that apple WILL do something vis a vis docs.
    They probably will. Nothing stopping them unless they think that doc editing is not necessary. We'll see.

    9.Better bluetooth. 2.0
    Better bluetooth would be welcome from what I hear... I don't use it so I can't say either way. I'm no BT expert but a quick look shows BT2.0 has possible higher speed, and possible lower power. Nothing I noticed in the 2.0 spec would make it a "slam dunk" over BT1.2. If Palm could fix their issue, BT1.2 appears to be plenty.

    10.integration with itunes will be amazing.....
    I don't use iTunes so I can say how wonderful it is. For its basic functionality syncing on the Treo is fine by me. I plug it in, sync, done in a minute. For pictures and music it is rather poor. I do think its time Palm re-does their desktop app to better address the added functionality of the newer devices.

    So am I getting an iphone? Definitely. Do I think it's not for power users? I consider myself a power user
    OK, to each their own. Personally I think the iPhone looks good in many ways. And as I said way way back at the top of this novel, I actually like Apple. However I feel that Apple is getting unjust amounts of credit for this "break through" phone. Since the iPhone was announce, I've seen references to 5 or 6 phones, already on the market, that do many if not most of the things the iPhone will.

    JM
    03-20-2007 09:59 PM
  9. jimmarako's Avatar
    Oh BTW Cardman, sorry... I didn't realize the post I replied to wasn't posted by you but by Chazzan. My bad.

    JM
    03-20-2007 10:02 PM
  10. Chazzan's Avatar
    OK, well I guess I "took the bait". Being new at this I should still have seen the warning signs. I'm no Treo whipping boy, and actually like Apple as a company (Back to my old Apple //e). Apple for me has been missing the mark since those early days. I imagine this thread will be moved to the iphone section as it should.


    I'm sure there will. There is a big difference being able to pop in a new battery when needed (daily, weekly,..) and ripping apart a $500 phone. Almost no one will actually pull out the knife and wrench needed to replace their battery on the road.


    Sorry, I mistook the Cingular voice mail demo for email. Voicemail features seem nice, but I delete my voice mail as soon as I get it... no good to me. I'll let others address any shortcomings of the Apple email (no VPN yet..)


    Funny, I don't remember insulting you in my reply... I currently have a 8GB SD card in my Treo. No reason future 32GB's won't work. Mutiple cards = Many GB's When/if the SD people get past their 32GB limit will Treo support it? Who knows, but iPhone will still be stuck at 8GB.


    Of the 100's of Treo/Palm apps probably only a few dozen are useful to most people, so your right, having few 3rd party apps is not necessarily a bad thing. I will say that if installing 3rd party apps makes your Treo unstable, well that is not Palm's fault... it is your fault and the fault of the app writer. Well see once the "non-approved" iPhone apps show up how unstable the iPhone becomes.


    I did not realize the amount of iPod accessories on Ebay. I thought Apple kept a lid on that kind of stuff. So iPhone stuff will be as readily available. BTW, again don't blame Palm if you got "crappy" Treo accessories. What makes you think iPhone accessories will be any better since they will be made by the same people?


    Since the iPhone virtual keyboard will be no larger than the Treo's it will probably be harder to type on due to lack of feel. We won't know until the iPhones are reviewed. If your a text junkie then yes the Treo keyboard could be limiting.. you really need one of those phone were the keyboard "slides out" sideway so you can type with two thumbs.


    I agree... wi-fi is nice. Again, no magic here though... if iPhone gets 3G it is either going to have to get bigger, or face battery shortages.


    They probably will. Nothing stopping them unless they think that doc editing is not necessary. We'll see.


    Better bluetooth would be welcome from what I hear... I don't use it so I can't say either way. I'm no BT expert but a quick look shows BT2.0 has possible higher speed, and possible lower power. Nothing I noticed in the 2.0 spec would make it a "slam dunk" over BT1.2. If Palm could fix their issue, BT1.2 appears to be plenty.


    I don't use iTunes so I can say how wonderful it is. For its basic functionality syncing on the Treo is fine by me. I plug it in, sync, done in a minute. For pictures and music it is rather poor. I do think its time Palm re-does their desktop app to better address the added functionality of the newer devices.


    OK, to each their own. Personally I think the iPhone looks good in many ways. And as I said way way back at the top of this novel, I actually like Apple. However I feel that Apple is getting unjust amounts of credit for this "break through" phone. Since the iPhone was announce, I've seen references to 5 or 6 phones, already on the market, that do many if not most of the things the iPhone will.

    JM
    Peace man. Didn't mean to insult. Looks like we've both got good points here. We'll just have to wait for the darn device to come out to see what it's really like. I'm just pretty dissatisfied with my 700p. Crashes a lot, very very slow and bluetooth doesn't work well at all. I'm so glad that iphone's coming out because it's already creating a lot of healthy competition which means our devices will be so much better in the near future.
    03-20-2007 10:47 PM
  11. jimmarako's Avatar
    Agree, the buzz the iPhone has been making appears to be changing the industry. Hey, if nothing else maybe it will get the carriers to loosen up a bit. Also maybe it will light a fire under Palm's a$$ to at least get the 700p working right. I really don't have the problems people mention, but apparently many do.

    Competition is usually a good thing. Sometimes competition leads to "minimal" features for $$ concerns, or dumbing down for mass appeal. The Cell phone market I think has plenty of room to expand before it stagnates in the future.

    JM
    03-20-2007 11:43 PM
  12. cardfan's Avatar
    I appreciate the responses. I didn't know there was an Iphone section. I suppose i was wanting responses from a 700p owner perspective..
    03-21-2007 07:30 AM
  13. haroldo's Avatar
    It's hard to get a fair assessment before anyone has used the product.
    03-21-2007 07:58 AM
  14. Chazzan's Avatar
    True, but I can honestly say that my old 650, which I sold to a friend, performs way better than my 700p. It doesn't crash, has the same apps, switches and loads apps WAY faster and works with bluetooth. This is why I am so disappointed and so eager to use something new from a company I trust (Apple).
    03-21-2007 09:24 AM
  15. Hdhntr23's Avatar
    how is this thread related to the 700P forum?
    03-21-2007 10:43 AM
  16. cardfan's Avatar
    Because it was being compared to the 700p. duh..
    03-21-2007 02:35 PM
  17. Pearl_Diva's Avatar
    I have concerns about storage and non-replacable battery too, just like some in this thread.

    Of course the 3G iPhone may be out by the time the battery does die. Still, if the old iPhone is in good condition, why dump it? With a new battery, you might be able to at least sell it to get the newer model. I guess we'll have to wait and see how much the replacement battery and labor will be. That will be one big drawback to the iPhone IMO. That and the power limitations of the integrated battery.

    As for storage, 12-15GB would have been better IMO, if they want this to sometimes replace your iPod. Although I am not sure 12GB flash is available yet anyway. But they should at least give the option of an expansion card IMO. With an 8GB card with the 8GB phone, that's the capacity.

    I also hope they loosen up on the 3rd party app restriction. I think if they don't want 3rd party apps installed, then they better think of everything BEFORE putting out this phone. But of course it may be impossible to forsee what most will or may need. Even if Apple releases 3rd party apps of it's own or on it's approval, fine. But we need 3rd party apps option.
    03-22-2007 08:01 AM
  18. oalvarez's Avatar
    my thoughts given the current specs: it will be less heavy and bulky, it will offer wi-fi/edge along with a larger screen with better resolution, and more on-board memory than any of the Treos i've ever owned. its design is current, modern and sleek, not antiquated like that of a Treo. hec, everyone and their mother carries a Treo so owning any other device would be the cool choice.

    replaceable battery? feh. not enough storage? feh.

    regards
    03-22-2007 08:32 AM
  19. Certs's Avatar
    my thoughts given the current specs: it will be less heavy and bulky, it will offer wi-fi/edge along with a larger screen with better resolution, and more on-board memory than any of the Treos i've ever owned. its design is current, modern and sleek, not antiquated like that of a Treo. hec, everyone and their mother carries a Treo so owning any other device would be the cool choice.

    replaceable battery? feh. not enough storage? feh.

    regards
    I can agree with the first part, but I do think batttery life will be a factor. I just don't see it lasting the whole day, but that's just me. If there is a day where I am going to be out and about with no access to a charger, I would have to swap SIMs and carry a different phone that day. Which is why I am going to wait a little while to hear some reviews (user reviews, not CNET, etc) before buying. Thank God Cingular uses SIM cards
    03-22-2007 11:34 AM
  20. archie's Avatar
    Second, is the 3rd party apps. I can make my Treo do what i want. Iphone won't record video or voice, and i doubt i'll be able to tether it to laptop. No java on safari from what i've read. Games might be lacking, but are rumored to be available on iphone. Not sure if Iphone will have ability to open docs, spreadsheets, etc.
    The iPhone will have a two-megapixel sensor manufactured by Micron Technology (and is about a quarter inch across at the diagonal - this is huge and will have very little noise). This two-megapixel camera also captures 30 fps. What we don't know for sure is whether or not Apple will enable this sensor's ability to capture video as the camera software was incomplete at the time of the keynote demonstration. But, it certainly is possible.

    I believe you are correct in presuming we will not be able to tether it to a laptop as a modem. I think that has been mentioned somewhere.

    The iPhone uses Apple's own webkit so it will support JavaScript.

    As far as opening docs and spreadsheets, although nothing has been announced, I would remind you that Apple purchased SchemaSoft almost 2 years ago now. That company developed open standards-based software that lets you extract the content found in common file formats, including Microsoft Office, Adobe PDF, Quark and others. It seems reasonable to assume that Apple had purchased this company for a reason, no?

    Third, its all touch screen. Treo still is much easier to use one hand.
    Just because Steve Jobs used the iPhone with 2 hands during the keynote doesn't mean you cannot use it with one. It would be important to note that during the keynote the iPhone device was being drawn down with cables. This forced the iPhone to be held and used in what could be considered an unusual fashion - everyday use would not consist of grasping the iPhone in your hand to keep the one inch thick grouping of cables tethered to it from pulling it out of your grip while thumb tapping.

    Forth, everyone and their mother will want or own an IPhone. If everyone has one, its not so cool..lol
    Eh, it took the iPod 5 years to reach this level of excessive popularity.
    03-22-2007 03:32 PM
  21. archie's Avatar
    As far as the iPhone is concerned, I can't imaging typing anything on a touch screen. I never type on the Treo's touch screen (onscreen dialing).
    I think once the "WOW" factor wears off, the iPhone will be a status symbol for the young people, but I don't think it can be a workhorse unit for people who need to type in a lot of data. I'm not saying Treos are perfect, but I don't think the iPhone is competing for the same customer as the Treo.
    I think typing may be easier than you believe. Using a Treo, your finger actually slows as it progresses through the pressing of a key. This provides for a tactile feedback but does slow the overall process to some degree. Sure you may get a somewhat satisfying clicking of sorts; but compare that to tapping without any need to fully depress a key.

    So with the iPhone there are no physical keys requiring a mechanical activation by a relatively precise placement of your finger as with the Treo (or BlackBerry or Motorola Q or etc., etc.). Instead, as your finger approaches the screen, you are presented with a visual que consisting of an enlarging of the anticipated key that you are aiming for. And then the process continues and a split second later, your finger actually hits the screen providing for a touch based feedback. The whole process is really more smooth AND in an unforeseen manner, actually gives the user a key to hit that is virtually larger than what is physically present.

    Part of what adds to the smoothness of typing on the iPhone is recognized when you realize that you do not actually need to fully depress a key for that clicking sensation/feedback.

    Sorry for this rather vague attempt at trying to explain the difference of typing on a Treo as compared to typing on an iPhone. It is the best I can do to try an explain a rather "hard to explain", and perhaps even abstract, concept.
    03-22-2007 04:01 PM
  22. archie's Avatar
    I have concerns about storage and non-replacable battery too, just like some in this thread.

    Of course the 3G iPhone may be out by the time the battery does die. Still, if the old iPhone is in good condition, why dump it? With a new battery, you might be able to at least sell it to get the newer model. I guess we'll have to wait and see how much the replacement battery and labor will be. That will be one big drawback to the iPhone IMO. That and the power limitations of the integrated battery.

    As for storage, 12-15GB would have been better IMO, if they want this to sometimes replace your iPod. Although I am not sure 12GB flash is available yet anyway. But they should at least give the option of an expansion card IMO. With an 8GB card with the 8GB phone, that's the capacity.

    I also hope they loosen up on the 3rd party app restriction. I think if they don't want 3rd party apps installed, then they better think of everything BEFORE putting out this phone. But of course it may be impossible to forsee what most will or may need. Even if Apple releases 3rd party apps of it's own or on it's approval, fine. But we need 3rd party apps option.
    Yeh, yeh, yeh. Consider this:
    If the iPod Nano is the most successful iPod ever, even compared to the iPods with greater storage capacity, don't you think the iPhone with it's 8GB of storage (which incidentally bests the iPod Nano by 2GBs) will be enough for the greater market share?

    It sounds to me like you are just hunting for specs with big numbers before thinking about actual usage.

    In regards to complaints about the battery being non-replacable, it seems that Phone Diva was complaining about the concern of not having enough power before, but now you are complaining about the overall life of the battery and how it will hold up to repeated charges.

    First, I'll say again what I have said before. The iPhone's battery life bests any other phone in it's class (ie: Q, Blackjack, Treo 680, BlackBerries etc.). Apple is a master of power savings features and OS X proves it.

    As far as the overall life of a battery, I can't help but think this should not be a concern to Americans who thrive on consumerism, especially you Phone Diva, with your ever-changing list of phones found in your TreoCentral signature. I'm not using this as any sort of excuse to cover up any sort of perceived deficiency in the iPhone, but I would like to bring to light this fact so that people might consider this issue when making a purchase decision . Regardless, the batteries in the iPods that Apple has been selling for the last several years have proven to last at LEAST 2 years while maintain that advertised playback time. That should definitely be something to consider.

    Incidentally, you will find that 2 years is the maximum length of phone contracts, which is about the length of time the average person holds on to their phone anyway.
    03-22-2007 04:10 PM
  23. Malatesta's Avatar
    First, I'll say again what I have said before. The iPhone's battery life bests any other phone in it's class (ie: Q, Blackjack, Treo 680, BlackBerries etc.). Apple is a master of power savings features and OS X proves it.
    So none of us can really make comments on the iPhone because it is not out yet, so no "fair" evaluation can be made.

    Yet you can come on here and say this and we should not question it? The critics cannot speculate but the fans can. And their laptop battery life is not exactly amazing with the Intel chips.

    Also, the Q, Blackjack and Blackberries are not in it's class for all the reasons we've mentioned before. I mean, if it can't to BES how it can it be "in the same class" as a BB? Or Exchange? You're not going to see iPhone's in the halls of corporate america.

    The iPhone is creating it's own niche market--that is extremely clear. If it steals anyone from the other groups, they were not people who really needed those devices as a tool but wanted a toy.
    Regardless, the batteries in the iPods that Apple has been selling for the last several years have proven to last at LEAST 2 years while maintain that advertised playback time. That should definitely be something to consider.

    Incidentally, you will find that 2 years is the maximum length of phone contracts, which is about the length of time the average person holds on to their phone anyway.
    They use LiON batteries. No magic there.

    LiON battery life-span is dependent on 4 major factors:

    1) Date of creation--they don't have very long shelf lives
    2) Temperature (both of storage and use)--the higher, the worse
    3) Draw: if the devices draws a lot of power vs slow trickle, it's worse
    4) Charge cycles: 300-500 for lion

    So it's not just "2 years" but dependent on the environment it is used in by the individual. People who use iPods every day for hours a time and frequently charge will have short-life spans than the occasional user.

    I have seen people zip through iPod batteries after 12 months (they were holding half their charge). Combine that with a cell-phone which is "always on", a video device and an iPod and you've drastically increased the charge/discharge rate.

    That's not an iPhone limitation either but with every electronic device.

    Maybe they are using a newer type of battery but there is no reason to think that and I'm not aware of any that are massed produced at this point.
    03-22-2007 08:53 PM
  24. Pearl_Diva's Avatar
    Yeh, yeh, yeh. Consider this:
    If the iPod Nano is the most successful iPod ever, even compared to the iPods with greater storage capacity, don't you think the iPhone with it's 8GB of storage (which incidentally bests the iPod Nano by 2GBs) will be enough for the greater market share?

    It sounds to me like you are just hunting for specs with big numbers before thinking about actual usage. Obviously you're unaware of MY iPod usage!! I personally need more storage, plain and simple!! Regardless of what others want or need! And as I already pointed out, some of the iPhone space will have to be taken up by other things, since this is also a phone.

    In regards to complaints about the battery being non-replacable, it seems that Phone Diva was complaining about the concern of not having enough power before, but now you are complaining about the overall life of the battery and how it will hold up to repeated charges. I can't have a battery that runs out before the end of day, NOR do I really like replacing internal batteries. I also usually buy a spare battery in case of the first battery going downhill, which is impossible for the iPhone. One big drawback for me is the iPhone battery.

    First, I'll say again what I have said before. The iPhone's battery life bests any other phone in it's class (ie: Q, Blackjack, Treo 680, BlackBerries etc.).Questionable since no one but the testers know for sure. Anyone on here a real tester? Apple is a master of power savings features and OS X proves it.

    As far as the overall life of a battery, I can't help but think this should not be a concern to Americans who thrive on consumerism, especially you Phone Diva, with your ever-changing list of phones found in your TreoCentral signature.Well it IS a concern, whether you like it or not. How are you supposed to get rid of phone with a dead non-replacable battery? Is Apple going to do a recycling program? I also couldn't sell a phone like that. I'd have to get the battery replaced first. I'm not using this as any sort of excuse to cover up any sort of perceived deficiency in the iPhone, but I would like to bring to light this fact so that people might consider this issue when making a purchase decision . Regardless, the batteries in the iPods that Apple has been selling for the last several years have proven to last at LEAST 2 years while maintain that advertised playback time. That should definitely be something to consider.Notice how Apple conveniently releases new models right around the time when batteries from the last model might be going dead .And before you say anything about Apple hating, I have more than one iPod and still wish I could use a Powerbook. *stuck with Windows due to software needs, at this time*

    Incidentally, you will find that 2 years is the maximum length of phone contracts, which is about the length of time the average person holds on to their phone anyway.And people often sell their old phones if they're the good ones, to pay for a new one. Except how to get rid of a dead non-replacable battery phone?
    My thoughts in red. And it isn't that I hate the iPhone, I just don't see it as the super-device everyone else thinks it is.
    03-23-2007 08:13 AM
  25. archie's Avatar
    So none of us can really make comments on the iPhone because it is not out yet, so no "fair" evaluation can be made.

    Yet you can come on here and say this and we should not question it?
    I wasn't speculating. I was making that statement based on published facts from the manufacturers.

    Is there a manufacturer that you do not trust to rely on published specs?


    Also, the Q, Blackjack and Blackberries are not in it's class for all the reasons we've mentioned before.
    What are these reasons? Seriously, Are you talking about the lack of BB software for the iPhone? The iPhone will have it's own unique solution for push email; just as the Nokia does with "Intellisync", just as the Q with "Good Technologies", just as the M$ based Treo 750 with "Exchange"...

    I mean, if it can't to BES how it can it be "in the same class" as a BB? Or Exchange? You're not going to see iPhone's in the halls of corporate america.

    The iPhone is creating it's own niche market--that is extremely clear. If it steals anyone from the other groups, they were not people who really needed those devices as a tool but wanted a toy.

    They use LiON batteries. No magic there.
    I don't see it as magic, I just see my comments as fact.
    03-27-2007 12:31 PM
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