10 Things that "Absolutely suck" about the iPhone. (Yes I have one)

[mikec#IM]

My favorite quote from Jobs today:

"Our products are usually not premium priced."

No iPhone news, just that they are happy with it's success.

 

[cmaier]

My favorite quote from Jobs today:

"Our products are usually not premium priced."

No iPhone news, just that they are happy with it's success.

Actually, one new iphone feature (publish photo from iphone to .mac web gallery, and synch back from web gallery. I'm not clear if the synching is wireless, but it sounded like it might be) was announced, so should be a firmware update shortly.

And, of course, several of the announced mac software upgrades now have support for iphone.

 

[Denny Crane]

I believe we have already established iPhone owners are uninformed fanboys, and would not know a good phone if it hit them upside the head.

Surur

And we have established that you are an iPhone hater and would degrade any device that puts your piece of crap phone to shame.......

 

[Slingbox]

Mr Crane The iPhone cant put any current ppc to shame .I really do wish Apple could have stepped up with a device that could of changed the hand held market to the positive but they failed....Copy & Past really does work for us left behind in WX land lol lol.
When or If you choose to respond to my very simple post I will be alerted by real Push mail to my WX.....WOW huh ..not bad for are outdated devices lol lol.
Let me know if you need any cab files built.I will be more then happy to help

Phil C

 

[bruckwine]

Actually, one new iphone feature (publish photo from iphone to .mac web gallery, and synch back from web gallery. I'm not clear if the synching is wireless, but it sounded like it might be) was announced, so should be a firmware update shortly.

And, of course, several of the announced mac software upgrades now have support for iphone.

Do you really consider those "features"? they should've been there from the start (esp. considering its apple products) and them allowing that is not what I would call a new phone feature, esp if it cannot be used outside of the iBubble. And that is a general criticism of ALL manufacturers/producers/companies who come out with something like louder volume or such and cal it a new feature. The iPhone already had wifi and Edge so why couldn't it sync with .mac before? Cut & paste or video camera (through some firmware of course ) etc would be a real update (imho mind you - let's not wiki this one to death!).

 

[Malatesta]

Do you really consider those "features"? they should've been there from the start (esp. considering its apple products) and them allowing that is not what I would call a new phone feature, esp if it cannot be used outside of the iBubble. And that is a general criticism of ALL manufacturers/producers/companies who come out with something like louder volume or such and cal it a new feature. The iPhone already had wifi and Edge so why couldn't it sync with .mac before? Cut & paste or video camera (through some firmware of course ) etc would be a real update (imho mind you - let's not wiki this one to death!).

eh, I wouldn't beat him up on that as it's a nice little addition. Of course, it is becoming quite evident that indeed the iPhone was forced into production before they could really finish the feature set.

As you pointed out, this doesn't seem to big of a deal not to have out the gates, so why do it now? OTOH, I'm sure there will be lots of these trickling out as development on their end progresses. It seems you are also forced to have a .mac account for this to work. I suppose it's not that different from MS Live (MSN, push LiveMail, etc.) on WM6 devices (actually, thankfully it looks like Palm took it out of the 750 WM6: wise move, imo).

The Foleo is basically in the same boat: it's being released, due to competition, under-spec'd and not really 1.0, with resulting frequent updates expected to be released along the way.

 

[bruckwine]

eh, I wouldn't beat him up on that as it's a nice little addition. Of course, it is becoming quite evident that indeed the iPhone was forced into production before they could really finish the feature set.

As you pointed out, this doesn't seem to big of a deal not to have out the gates, so why do it now? OTOH, I'm sure there will be lots of these trickling out as development on their end progresses. It seems you are also forced to have a .mac account for this to work. I suppose it's not that different from MS Live (MSN, push LiveMail, etc.) on WM6 devices (actually, thankfully it looks like Palm took it out of the 750 WM6: wise move, imo).

The Foleo is basically in the same boat: it's being released, due to competition, under-spec'd and not really 1.0, with resulting frequent updates expected to be released along the way.

Don't get me wrong I'm not "beating up on" cmaier..I'm just surprised that companies like MSFT and APPL can keep using marketing gimmicks like this (calling them new features) and that ppl uby into it. I also don't re. consider things like MSN Live as features of any winmobile hardware. A new feature to me would be if the iPhone could now do AD2P bt stereo, or if the iPod could now play .wmv and .avi...not that another piece of software (.mac, iWorks etc) now cater for it - I consider those new features on the OTHER software/hardware if anything rather than a new iPhone feature.

 

[cmaier]

Don't get me wrong I'm not "beating up on" cmaier..I'm just surprised that companies like MSFT and APPL can keep using marketing gimmicks like this (calling them new features) and that ppl uby into it. I also don't re. consider things like MSN Live as features of any winmobile hardware. A new feature to me would be if the iPhone could now do AD2P bt stereo, or if the iPod could now play .wmv and .avi...not that another piece of software (.mac, iWorks etc) now cater for it - I consider those new features on the OTHER software/hardware if anything rather than a new iPhone feature.

sort of felt like "beating up" from where i'm sitting, but whatever. this feature is of no use to me (though i tried browsing their test gallery and it really is very nicely done), but it's still a "feature."

What's also interesting is, apparently, it was already on the phone - no new firmware was needed. It looks like it was on a timer or something.

I've said all along I expect a lot of new stuff to come out when leopard comes out, since they share a lot of code; this is just another case of iphone stuff being "released" when the desktop part was ready as well.

 

[surur]

I've said all along I expect a lot of new stuff to come out when leopard comes out, since they share a lot of code; this is just another case of iphone stuff being "released" when the desktop part was ready as well.

This is surely a joke. The platforms may share design intentions, but I would be really surprised if a memory constrained ARM device with a limited interface and slow processor share much code at all with its desktop counterpart.

I mean, where's iTunes for the iPhone, unless thats a Leopard feature too.

Surur

 

[oalvarez]

is it truly memory constrained? i've been trying out a Sprint Mogul and it truly does slow to a standstill if the user doesn't keep after the open programs but i yet to cause my iPhone to stop functioning because of my usage (yes, i understand other users have experienced Safari crashes and the like). anyhow, could the iPhone simply do a better job of managing memory or open programs? just askin'.

 

[surur]

is it truly memory constrained? i've been trying out a Sprint Mogul and it truly does slow to a standstill if the user doesn't keep after the open programs but i yet to cause my iPhone to stop functioning because of my usage (yes, i understand other users have experienced Safari crashes and the like). anyhow, could the iPhone simply do a better job of managing memory or open programs? just askin'.

The iPhone has 128 MB memory. Many people are experiencing problems related to opening large web pages, glitches building up when the device is not rebooted after a few days, and inability to reliably use Ipod and Safari at the same time. These all strongly suggest memory management problems.

Do you still have your Mongul then? I thought you returned it 2 days ago now.

Surur

 

[cmaier]

This is surely a joke. The platforms may share design intentions, but I would be really surprised if a memory constrained ARM device with a limited interface and slow processor share much code at all with its desktop counterpart.

I mean, where's iTunes for the iPhone, unless thats a Leopard feature too.

Surur

as the tuaw (and other) hackers have shown, many of the libraries are identical (in many cases merely a subset) of their desktop counterparts. This is why objective-c programmers with familiarity with the desktop libraries have been able to pick up coding so fast.

by "shared code" i really refer to the @interfaces. I'm sure @implementations are, by necessity, quite different.

 

[cmaier]

The iPhone has 128 MB memory. Many people are experiencing problems related to opening large web pages, glitches building up when the device is not rebooted after a few days, and inability to reliably use Ipod and Safari at the same time. These all strongly suggest memory management problems.

Do you still have your Mongul then? I thought you returned it 2 days ago now.

Surur

Note that the 128 MB is physical memory. Given that the processor's address space is far larger than that and given that the OS shares many stripped-and-recompiled components with OS X, it might very well support virtual memory (I've seen only speculation with regard to this, however.) I did read threads on howardforums and macrumors that indicated people who had more or less filled up their 4GB or 8GB were having more "memory-related" symptoms than those who did not. (I have about 1.25GB free and haven't had to do any reboots except for an IMAP issue where it caches DNS and if your imap server changes IP it gets confused - this seems like it may have been fixed in 1.0.1 however). If there really is a corrolation, it might come down to running out of virtual memory.

 

[surur]

We speculated about virtual memory in this thread, and I said due to performance issues related to slow NAND speeds, this was very unlikely. I have seen to reason to change this opinion.

Surur

 

[surur]

Its funny when people try and explore the more advanced aspects of the iPhone and find absolutely nothing...

- I just paired iPhone to powerbook. does nothing.

japasneezemonk 08-07-2007 10:22 PM

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I just paired iPhone to powerbook. does nothing.

I was excited for a few minutes. I had tried it before, and it had not worked. Now it paired, but did little else.


siurpeeman 08-07-2007 10:25 PM

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

it'd be nice if it worked with address book, all the features steve jobs touted when jaguar was released. i'd love to initiate a call from my mac or be alerted to a call on my computer screen. i'm hoping it'll be added in an update.

FreeState 08-07-2007 10:40 PM

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I wish it just synced with .Mac - I usually only plug my phone in to sync contacts etc. Now with the photo to .mac option announced today if it synced with .mac for contacts etc it would be a great enhancement.

pdpfilms 08-07-2007 10:50 PM

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Quote:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Originally Posted by siurpeeman (Post 4016988)
it'd be nice if it worked with address book, all the features steve jobs touted when jaguar was released. i'd love to initiate a call from my mac or be alerted to a call on my computer screen. i'm hoping it'll be added in an update.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


I was so completely surprised not to see these features built in.

If they aren't implemented before iPhone gen2, I'll be supremely disappointed.

http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=338762

Surur

 

[cmaier]

We speculated about virtual memory in this thread, and I said due to performance issues related to slow NAND speeds, this was very unlikely. I have seen to reason to change this opinion.

Surur

NAND speeds are far faster than disk speeds, and every desktop uses disk for virtual memory. A typical hard drive has, what, 5-10 ms access time? A typical nand-flash drive is around 0.1ms read access time? (The actual numbers vary, and probably have gotten better since the last time I looked, but the difference is still large.).

Additionally, it is clear that iphone programs can load files much larger than 128MB. So either every one of those programs is paging on its own, or the OS is doing the paging. Given that the code for paging already existed in the OS kernel, I'm guessing they wouldn't be eager to reinvent the wheel.

 

[surur]

NAND speeds are far faster than disk speeds, and every desktop uses disk for virtual memory. A typical hard drive has, what, 5-10 ms access time? A typical nand-flash drive is around 0.1ms read access time? (The actual numbers vary, and probably have gotten better since the last time I looked, but the difference is still large.).

Additionally, it is clear that iphone programs can load files much larger than 128MB. So either every one of those programs is paging on its own, or the OS is doing the paging. Given that the code for paging already existed in the OS kernel, I'm guessing they wouldn't be eager to reinvent the wheel.

NAND may have fast access times, but read times are pretty slow. Look it up.

From Wikipedia:

Slower than conventional disks on sequential I/O, the latest perpendicular hard disks doing about 150 Megabytes/sec read, with the latest SSDs doing about 50 Megabytes/sec read.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solid_state_disk

Re reading large files, the iPhone is obviously streaming from storage. It does not handle large web pages with many pictures very well for example, implying there is no paging.

Surur

 

[surur]

There are 3 things amusing about this thread quoted. 1) The reliance on buttons to resuscitate the mostly button-less iPhone 2) The flawed belief the iPhone required free storage to function properly, implying some kind of virtual memory. I call that voodoo thinking. 3) 3rd party apps being blamed for the ills of the iPhone, despite there being no sanctioned SDK. Jobs' attempt to avoid the 3rd party software debacle has clearly failed.

- IPHONE CRASHED, locked up, will not do anything

Cody_300ex 07-04-2007 01:14

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

IPHONE CRASHED, locked up, will not do anything

I was looking threw my missed calls and it locked up, i have tried pluging it in the computer, car charger, holding the power button down, everything. It will not budge. This is my bussiness phone so i need help ASAP!!!

mike772 07-04-2007 01:16

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Try a reset hold sleep + home until it reboots.

Jay05 07-04-2007 01:16

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

This happened to me too. Hold the power button (top of phone) and the home button at the bottom of the phone at the same time. This will hard reset it.

I wasn't taking chances. I took the phone back to the Apple store where I bought it and exchanged it.

foofighter 07-04-2007 01:22

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

i had mine lock up as well during some email viewing and it locked up and i held down the home button and it fixed it.

Cody_300ex 07-04-2007 01:45

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

thanks so much guys, its back up and running again.

mike772 07-04-2007 01:53

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Glad to hear!

spaztaz 07-04-2007 02:16

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

aahh this happened to me man. my iphone has been freezing on and off for hte past day and half and i cant exhcnage it yet becuase my apple store is sold out

Crysis6 08-08-2007 05:57

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Mine is doing it too. Any reason why this is occurring??? I guess I'll have to exchange. Ughh What a pain.

Fray Adjacent 08-08-2007 06:25

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Guys, if it's locking up, first off, shut it off, then turn it back on. You should do this every couple days. After all, the iPhone IS a computer, and most modern OSs need to be restarted.

If the lockups keep happening, do a restore.

THEN if they keep happening, I'd consider an exchange.

scaredpoet 08-08-2007 13:39

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Out of curiosity, how "full" do you guys have your iPhone? Is it filled up to the brim with songs/videos/photos? If so, I'm thinking the problem might be that phone needs a small amount of memory free as overhead. This is pretty common for OS X, the operating system running on this phone. Try leaving a couple of MB free and see what happens.

mjs975s 08-08-2007 14:05

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I'm interested to see if any of these are "hacked" or have "unsupported" modifications made such as custom ringtones.

http://www.howardforums.com/showthread.php?t=1193742

Surur

 

[cmaier]

even if the wikipedia numbers are true (those are bandwidth, not access time, of course), 50MB/s is still as fast as a lot of hard disks still in use (you are comparing to 'the latest perpendicular hard disks,' presumably with sata-300 since that's how most of those are sold). For example, here is samsung, about a year ago, claiming their ssd's have higher bandwidth than normal hard drives: http://www.technologynewsdaily.com/node/3030. They cite similar bandwidth numbers for SSD, which means they are probably not comparing to "the latest" perpendicular hard drives.

And given that the processor is only 600MHz or so, that's plenty fast (the slower the processor, the less relative penalty for a given slow memory access).

in any event, while we don't know the specifications of the flash in the iphone, it seems likely it falls into the realm of at least slower disk drives, and thus would work fine for virtual memory. (PC's have had virtual memory for far longer than perpendicular hard drives have existed).

You assert "does not handle large web pages with many pictures..." Can you point me at a page so i can try it? I've loaded some awfully big photo galleries without a problem. (The limitation i've seen is on a single large photo, but only when that photo is an animated gif.)

I've also loaded more than one 300MB pdf in separate safari tabs and been able to tab instantly between the tabs, and, within a document, flick from page to page. I hardly think it's "obviously streaming." (I'm not sure whether by "streaming" you mean that in a technical sense or not. note that virtual memory does not mean using the nand as if it is RAM - it means moving pages back and forth between RAM and the nand. The cpu always accesses RAM, never the nand.)

 

[cmaier]

ps: why "voodoo thinking?" LOTS of people have reported instability related to their phones being full.

You refuse to believe that's a possibility, but you believe it when the same quantity of people claim their phone crashes daily?

And why do you believe in "streaming" but not virtual memory? The end effect is the same (keeping things on nand until they are needed by the processor, then moving them to RAM) but the work for the programmers in implementing "streaming" is far more difficult than implementing virtual memory (for which they already had source code).