1. mikec#IM's Avatar
    First, do you understand English? You understand potential, may, can, if etc? If so, how do you translate it into "all"? I started doubting your credentials, now I am doubting your intelligence.



    Please dont go setting up straw men. And read up on fuzzing.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fuzz_testing

    Surur
    Parry and thrust...
    08-01-2007 01:44 PM
  2. surur's Avatar
    The iPhone unintuitive and arkward? Maybe it needs a start menu...

    - My problem with the iPhone.

    The General 08-01-2007 11:07 AM

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    My problem with the iPhone.

    After a month of using my iPhone, I finally figured out what my problem was with it, and why other people were so confused when trying to use it. It's not to do with lacking features or needing a software update, or even the instability problems that plague Safari. It's just a strange design that is not entirely intuitive.

    One problem is that various web tasks that would normally all be done in Safari are separated into different Applications. For instance, when I show someone a video on YouTube, and they want to go to Google, they get all confused and can't figure it out. Instead of just going from www.youtube.com to www.google.com, you have to press the Home Button and tap on Safari. Same thing in reverse, if someone wants to show me a video (I won't even get into the lack of video content from YouTube today), they try and find it in Google, which churns up videos on MetaCafe, eBaums World, Google Videos, Myspace Videos, YouTube, etc ... And only some videos from one of those sources works on the iPhone. People get disappointed when that happens.

    Another example of this is Google Maps. I show someone a location on Google Maps, and they, for example, go to the website of King's Mongolian BBQ in Northridge to see what's up with the place, getting back to the map is very confusing for them. Instead of just hitting back, or switching tabs ... you have to, once again, press the home button and then tap Google Maps. If they could some how get Safari to distiguish between AJAX "dragging" and normal scrolling, then maps.google.com would get a lot more use from me.

    YouTube, Google Maps, and Safari need some sort of integration other than their ability to open eachother with links. Once the Flash plugin comes out, I'll probably just use Safari.

    Oh, and the physical home button really confuses people some times. I've had to say "it's a real button" probably 20 times.

    badtzmaru 08-01-2007 11:57 AM

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    i do wish there were a faster way to switch between apps.
    http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=33629

    Surur
    08-01-2007 01:49 PM
  3. braj's Avatar
    Everything will be unintuitive and awkward to some people. The iPhone sounds very similar to a Treo in dealing with Google Maps, Blazer and YouTube (via Kinoma, which sucks btw). I agree that it would be nice to if YouTube, Google Maps, and Safari had some more integration, but specific widgets to get web content seems more efficient to me than doing everything within Safari.
    08-01-2007 02:42 PM
  4. surur's Avatar
    Oops! Update problems...

    - The Update Is Tearing Apart My Iphone!!!

    SUPERSTEVE9219 08-01-2007 04:12 AM

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    The Update Is Tearing Apart My Iphone!!!

    Ok well I had a perfect iPhone you could say, no problems whatsoever, no polkadots, loud speaker, good battery life. Ok after the update my phone worked good for the first 30 mins then it froze. I did a hard reset and it was fine for 10 mins and it froze and I had to do another hard reset, after that it wouldnt go any longer than 7 to 8 mins. But that was the only problem, so I was trying to post this and my iPhone wouldn't stay logged into any page, I would log in then go to another page and it would ask me to log back in, so posting this from my iPhone was impossible. Then my the WiFi totally stopped working, it wouldn't connect to my default network or any other network. Oh no but thats not it, the clicks when typing where extremely loud then the speaker started cracking and its tone completely change from that sharp click to a low click with lots of cracking and the volume just kept droping intel it was almost impossible to hear.

    ****ing great, now my home menu is completely blank and only shows the AT&T, signal, time, and battery.


    Anyone else having problems? Im going to do a system restore, hopefully that fixes it


    added:
    Checked all apps, no issues.
    Leaving for work now. If I have any issues, I'll post from phone. Good luck all.

    yoman 08-01-2007 06:30 AM

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    Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU like Mac OS X; en) AppleWebKit/420+ (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/3.0 Mobile/1C25 Safari/419.3)

    do you or did you have any mods or custom ringtones installed on your iphone during or after the update? That could be the problem. Have you done a software restore? That seems to have solved many iphone users problems with the update.

    javaGuru 08-01-2007 06:57 AM

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    Quote:

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Originally Posted by SUPERSTEVE9219 (Post 3986921)
    Ok well I had a perfect iPhone you could say, no problems whatsoever, no polkadots, loud speaker, good battery life. Ok after the update my phone worked good for the first 30 mins then it froze. I did a hard reset and it was fine for 10 mins and it froze and I had to do another hard reset, after that it wouldnt go any longer than 7 to 8 mins. But that was the only problem, so I was trying to post this and my iPhone wouldn't stay logged into any page, I would log in then go to another page and it would ask me to log back in, so posting this from my iPhone was impossible. Then my the WiFi totally stopped working, it wouldn't connect to my default network or any other network. Oh no but thats not it, the clicks when typing where extremely loud then the speaker started cracking and its tone completely change from that sharp click to a low click with lots of cracking and the volume just kept droping intel it was almost impossible to hear.

    ****ing great, now my home menu is completely blank and only shows the AT&T, signal, time, and battery.


    Anyone else having problems? Im going to do a system restore, hopefully that fixes it
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------



    Just currious, but did you use some of the program hacks to install ringtones to your iphone?

    SUPERSTEVE9219 08-01-2007 01:04 PM

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    No my iPhone was hack and ringtone free, I eventually got it working but it took a long time, first iTunes wouldn't recognize my iPhone and my iPhone wouldn't go into sync mode, I eventually got it to work but it took forever to restore it like a hour.

    It seems to be working but ill report back after I use it for a while

    rodneyi 08-01-2007 01:27 PM

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    I've had the exact same problems. The update made me do a restore because of the jailbreak hack. Since the update my phone will freeze up when I unlock the phone from sleep mode with a black screen and just the top bar showing. One time it froze on the slide to unlock screen and wouldn't let me unlock the phone. I've had to hard reset my phone about 4 times now. I also cannot get connected to my wi-fi network anymore and my yahoo push mail keeps trying to connect and load emails. All of this has caused a rapid battery drain on my phone. After the hard reset, the usage meter is not even working as well. This bites!
    http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=336201

    Surur
    08-01-2007 02:48 PM
  5. Pearl_Diva's Avatar
    If they add enough firmware updates by Christmas, and one of them includes IM, OR there are rumors of another updated model(that's common with Apple) with more features, the iPhone will then be added to my list.

    I never wrote the iPhone off entirely, it's just that the first edition is too limited for the price.
    08-01-2007 02:54 PM
  6. braj's Avatar

    I never wrote the iPhone off entirely, it's just that the first edition is too limited for the price.
    Exactly. I really hope Apple gets 3rd party apps , IM, and more storage. I'm still not sold on the keyboard but could survive I'm sure.
    08-01-2007 03:02 PM
  7. Malatesta's Avatar
    Everything will be unintuitive and awkward to some people. The iPhone sounds very similar to a Treo in dealing with Google Maps, Blazer and YouTube (via Kinoma, which sucks btw). I agree that it would be nice to if YouTube, Google Maps, and Safari had some more integration, but specific widgets to get web content seems more efficient to me than doing everything within Safari.
    I certainly see it both ways. I think it's nice having a dedicated Youtube player, but if someone sends you a link in email or on a website, you run into "technical" issues if you want to watch it, correct? Still, these seem more like pet-peeves. Mobile video streaming is still very, very young.

    Hopefully they will allow more integration with updates.

    Speaking of, TC's own zBop wrote a nice PIE plugin for Youtube, Google Video, Veoh and Mobetube. Now you just click on any video link on those sites (not the mobile youtube either, the real site) and it'll open up TCPMP and stream the content. No hacking involved. :thumbsup:
    08-01-2007 03:14 PM
  8. braj's Avatar
    Speaking of, TC's own zBop wrote a nice PIE plugin for Youtube, Google Video, Veoh and Mobetube. Now you just click on any video link on those sites (not the mobile youtube either, the real site) and it'll open up TCPMP and stream the content. No hacking involved. :thumbsup:
    Where's the info on that? I'm sure TCPIP would do a better job with video than Kinoma.
    08-01-2007 03:18 PM
  9. Malatesta's Avatar
    Exactly. I really hope Apple gets 3rd party apps , IM, and more storage. I'm still not sold on the keyboard but could survive I'm sure.
    It'd also be nice if they had a much more lenient testing period for new users. A 14 day trial with possible re-stocking fee seems quite risky for such a device. Imagine if they had a 30 day, no strings attached, evaluation period? How cool would that be?

    Normally, I could see how that's a risk for AT&T and Apple, seeing as now those devices are "used", etc. But it's not like they aren't making a killing already to allow such lenient evaluation periods. Doesn't Verizon do something like that?
    08-01-2007 03:19 PM
  10. Malatesta's Avatar
    Where's the info on that? I'm sure TCPIP would do a better job with video than Kinoma.
    Right here. It's so cool. Quality is quite good (depending on the content, of course).

    But alas, you using Kinoma...which means POS! This is a WM plugin only. (Though, maybe someone in the community could talk to zbop about the technical details of how it works and it can be applied to POS?)
    08-01-2007 03:21 PM
  11. mobileman's Avatar
    The iPhone unintuitive and arkward? Maybe it needs a start menu...Surur

    The funniest thing I read all year. Ha, start menu and intuitive don't really belong in the same sentence.
    08-01-2007 03:22 PM
  12. mobileman's Avatar
    Right here. It's so cool. Quality is quite good (depending on the content, of course).

    But alas, you using Kinoma...which means POS! This is a WM plugin only. (Though, maybe someone in the community could talk to zbop about the technical details of how it works and it can be applied to POS?)

    The author recommends scaling the CPU, No Thanks. Uses PIE, no Thanks.

    However, it is still a very cool app, written by somebody clearly with alot of coding skills.

    Almost tempted to load it on my extra 8125, but that low-rez screen keeps getting in the way of me ever wanting to use it again.
    08-01-2007 03:25 PM
  13. mobileman's Avatar
    Exactly. I really hope Apple gets 3rd party apps , IM, and more storage. I'm still not sold on the keyboard but could survive I'm sure.
    Best keyboard on the market, in my opinion.
    08-01-2007 03:26 PM
  14. braj's Avatar
    Best keyboard on the market, in my opinion.
    Not when you want to use it as a launcher to get to app, urls, make calls etc. My keyboard is a huge boon to me, coming from a TX. with the right software it definitely is a strength of the Treo. I can pick it up in the dark, with blurry vision, and launch my alarm clock or make a call. I would like the best of all worlds ultimately: hard keys, small size, big screen. Palm made a compromise, Apple made a compromise. I see the strengths and limitations of both and am not sure which compromise I'm willing to make quite yet. Hopefully a device comes along that doesn't force a compromise on me.
    08-01-2007 03:59 PM
  15. surur's Avatar
    The placebo effect doesn't work for everyone?

    Also, did Apple reduce Safari's memory usage by reducing the resolution of the graphics?

    - - What Apple forum is reporting...

    BIGMERF 08-01-2007 14:57

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    What Apple forum is reporting...

    ok here are some of the changes the people over at the apple forums are reporting.. anybody seeing these changes?

    1.volume changes
    2.calender alerts in sound settings
    3.spam folder now desplays junk mail
    4.music plays during safari navigating...no crashes
    5.phone remembers network name and password and auto rejoins networks
    6.battery meter displays full charge and glows.
    7.vpn issues are fixed
    8.passcode lock feature offers up to an hr now.
    9.glitches in google maps have been repaired
    10.overall faster phone responses..navigating phone,internet, button response, etc.
    11.calculator issues fixed.

    fabsambh 08-01-2007 15:02

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    I signed on to I tunes but did not get anything that would ask me to update, is there something that needs to be done to direct the process?

    mjohns2 08-01-2007 15:11

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    Click update iPhone

    scaredpoet 08-01-2007 16:12

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    Quote:
    Originally Posted by BIGMERF
    11.calculator issues fixed.




    There were calculator issues?

    EDIT: So there are, or were anyway, some calculator bugs. however, it looks like indeed they are fixed with 1.01

    XanderMac 08-01-2007 16:14

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    Volume is the same and calendar alerts have always been there. iPod still crashes, mine just did as I was typing this!

    homegeek 08-01-2007 18:11

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    I would love it if they fixed the volume but I notice no difference. I hope they do fix it because this is the worst I have seen on any of my phones.

    shtekler 08-01-2007 19:10

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by BIGMERF
    ok here are some of the changes the people over at the apple forums are reporting.. anybody seeing these changes?

    1.volume changes
    2.calender alerts in sound settings
    3.spam folder now desplays junk mail
    4.music plays during safari navigating...no crashes
    5.phone remembers network name and password and auto rejoins networks
    6.battery meter displays full charge and glows.
    7.vpn issues are fixed
    8.passcode lock feature offers up to an hr now.
    9.glitches in google maps have been repaired
    10.overall faster phone responses..navigating phone,internet, button response, etc.
    11.calculator issues fixed.



    I am very sorry but my picture quietly of safri is bad no high resolution any more I will try to restore it to ver#1

    kaidomac 08-01-2007 19:33

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    Volume seems the same for me, unfortunately. My iPhone has been incredibly stable so far too, so I haven't really noticed any stability issues.
    http://www.howardforums.com/showthread.php?t=1213613

    Surur
    08-01-2007 04:03 PM
  16. mobileman's Avatar
    Not when you want to use it as a launcher to get to app, urls, make calls etc. My keyboard is a huge boon to me, coming from a TX. with the right software it definitely is a strength of the Treo. I can pick it up in the dark, with blurry vision, and launch my alarm clock or make a call. I would like the best of all worlds ultimately: hard keys, small size, big screen. Palm made a compromise, Apple made a compromise. I see the strengths and limitations of both and am not sure which compromise I'm willing to make quite yet. Hopefully a device comes along that doesn't force a compromise on me.
    I just touch the screen.

    I Love the fact when I don't need the keyboard, I dont have to give up any screen real estate.
    08-01-2007 04:13 PM
  17. mobileman's Avatar
    The placebo effect doesn't work for everyone?

    Also, did Apple reduce Safari's memory usage by reducing the resolution of the graphics?


    http://www.howardforums.com/showthread.php?t=1213613

    Surur
    My graphics seem exactly the same. I guess you would know that if you ever used one.
    08-01-2007 04:14 PM
  18. braj's Avatar
    I just touch the screen.

    I Love the fact when I don't need the keyboard, I dont have to give up any screen real estate.
    I 'downgraded' from the same sized screen (in pixels, actually a larger screen really) and am much more happy launching things with buttons. I 'touched' my TX's screen with my fingers in the same way you do for the iPhone so I'm all over that experience. Real button have real advantages. Really. They do.
    08-01-2007 04:17 PM
  19. surur's Avatar
    More update problems. I wonder why he blames AT&T though. Its not like they have any input in Apple's updates.

    - - 1.0.1 Update service problems

    drew0020 08-01-2007 01:20 PM

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    1.0.1 Update service problems

    My phone was perfect before the update. I updated last night and am getting no service messages during the day at work. I cannot seem to get service back. Unfortunately I cannot restore until I am home, but is that my only option? Very frustrating!

    fmcgirt 08-01-2007 02:44 PM

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    Quote:

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Originally Posted by drew0020 (Post 3988778)
    My phone was perfect before the update. I updated last night and am getting no service messages during the day at work. I cannot seem to get service back. Unfortunately I cannot restore until I am home, but is that my only option? Very frustrating!
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------


    Mine was not perfect before the update as I had erratic reception from time to time but I had exactly the same No Service problem last night after the 1.0.1 update. I tried everything I could think of like rebooting, doing the update again, AirPlane Mode On and Off, etc., and nothing helped. I was afraid it was the SIM card so I put it in another phone and it worked fine. I finally left it and went to bed and this morning all was fine. I think that the problem was that AT&T had a problem activating the phone after the update for some reason. Very frustrating!

    Frank

    Virtualball 08-01-2007 02:51 PM

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    I have the EXACT same issue! Wow, I thought it was just me! I get the "AT&T needs to check activation sign, but I have no service so it can't check! Not cool, AT&T not cool...

    fmcgirt 08-01-2007 03:04 PM

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    Quote:

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Originally Posted by Virtualball (Post 3989211)
    I have the EXACT same issue! Wow, I thought it was just me! I get the "AT&T needs to check activation sign, but I have no service so it can't check! Not cool, AT&T not cool...
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------


    Something in the update caused this and somehow slipped through the testing between AT&T and Apple.
    I never understand how something like this happens as there is nothing subtle about this one. I have the 4GB model and I wonder if it could be only happening to them since I have seen many reports of successful updates?

    Frank
    http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=336338

    Surur
    08-01-2007 04:24 PM
  20. mobileman's Avatar
    I 'downgraded' from the same sized screen (in pixels, actually a larger screen really) and am much more happy launching things with buttons. I 'touched' my TX's screen with my fingers in the same way you do for the iPhone so I'm all over that experience. Real button have real advantages. Really. They do.
    a palm tx?

    the buttons were alot smaller on the tx than they are on the iPhone. No usable on screen keyboard (dont even mention stylus). What buttons were you using, the dpad?
    08-01-2007 04:25 PM
  21. surur's Avatar
    I 'downgraded' from the same sized screen (in pixels, actually a larger screen really) and am much more happy launching things with buttons. I 'touched' my TX's screen with my fingers in the same way you do for the iPhone so I'm all over that experience. Real button have real advantages. Really. They do.
    I thought high-res screens like 320x480 were invented by Apple? Dont say it ain't so!

    Surur
    08-01-2007 04:25 PM
  22. mobileman's Avatar
    More update problems. I wonder why he blames AT&T though. Its not like they have any input in Apple's updates.


    http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=336338

    Surur
    a few users here and there with update problems. Why don't we ask treo users (especially the poor treo 700p souls) on how their system updates are going.
    08-01-2007 04:28 PM
  23. surur's Avatar
    A not so silly question - how to overcome the smoke and mirrors on iPhone graphics?

    And a follow-up question - whats the maximum zoom on a PDF on an iPhone?

    - - silly question...

    macmadandproud 08-01-2007 10:15 AM

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    silly question...

    Sorry if the answer to this is obvious, but it seems that it is not to me...

    I want to put an image on my phone of the London tube map. It is approx 1500 x 1000 and I want to keep it this size so that I can use the zoom in to view specific stations and lines... is there a way to do this? Whenever I load it in via iPhoto, the image is so small that whenever I zoom in, it is all blurry.

    I also tried e-mailing the large image to myself, but it seems that in email you hardly get any zoom at all...

    Is this even doable? I seem to remember seeing a preference somewhere to turn off resizing when syncing from iphoto but I can't seem to find it.

    I leave for London in 4 hours, and will truly be lost without someone's help!!

    Thanks!

    R

    LanikaiGirl 08-01-2007 11:35 AM

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    Try this:

    http://software.hixie.ch/utilities/cgi/data/data

    I have some blue prints I need to have with me, and it worked beautifully. It basically creates a copy of your document hidden in the bookmark.

    macmadandproud 08-01-2007 11:50 AM

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Thanks for the link, however I need to have it with me, and can't afford to pay for web access while roaming.

    This will just make it a link in safari, correct?



    jecapaga 08-01-2007 02:42 PM

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    not sure if this works...save it as a pdf and email it to yourself to an account you can view on your iphone as an attachment. perhaps this allows for zooming.
    http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=336278

    Surur
    08-01-2007 05:39 PM
  24. mikec#IM's Avatar
    Best keyboard on the market, in my opinion.
    You've used a lot of devices with keyboards, correct?

    Despite the comments from "it's not so bad" to "wonderful", compared to other physical keyboards, the iPhone's isn't all that good. (prone to errors if you want to type fast.)

    I think it depends on a couple things - how big your fingers are, and how you hold the device.

    I agree that people really should play around with it and draw their own conclusions. Web browsing, which everyone heralds, is actually sorta frustrating - first, the full page view is too tiny, and the zoom-in, finger drag or flick to view the page. There is a lot of gesturing needed just to read through a page.

    Coming from using a D-Pad to scroll up and down and scroll left/right, it's definitely more work.

    And of course, the vertical to horizontal switching is very angle dependent, and quite often doesn't work.

    Like I said, I agree people should try it for themselves and draw their own conclusions.

    I keep trying to like the iPhone, but I find if I have to make a lot of effort (swipes, presses, gestures, etc.) to get something done.
    08-01-2007 06:43 PM
  25. braj's Avatar
    Yep, with buttons it is a one-handed, slight movement of the thumb. With iPhone, it is mostly a two-handed, more dramatic movements to get things done. I love the idea, and I love the screen real estate, but I'll visit the low-bandwidth, mobile versions of sites for now, avoid lots of adds (I like that part a lot), and do it one handed most of the time. Then when I need two hands instead of having a UI that is dominated by large buttons, I have a pinpoint stylus which has worked really well for me for years and years.

    I'm not saying that the Palm is superior or anything, what I'm saying is different things work well on different devices. I would like to see the best of all devices and technologies melded into one uber-device that doesn't throw the baby out with the bathwater, so to speak. And I want the freedom to do what I want with it regarding the possibilities of the hardware and software.
    08-01-2007 07:42 PM
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