Tragic shooting at an elementary school in CT...

anon(631531)

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My nephew has depression, bi-polar disorder and mild schizophrenia...he's on medications and what not, and can be quite a challenge to deal with when he's having a manic mood. That said, I've taken him to the range with me (both of my nephews in fact), we've gone many times, and he's been respectful of the weapon, the rules and instruction when we've gone...to be honest, showing him how to handle a firearm is not going to turn him into a murderer and executioner...and i don't think it's fair at all to say that the mother some how made a poor choice in teaching her son how to shoot a gun at a firing range, she may have been trying to help him, trying to bond with him...and while yes, there are things you could do to bond without shooting guns, some people consider that as normal as watching a movie or having lunch.

He was psychotic and he murdered these kids and adults himself...not because his mom taught him how to shoot a gun. Would you assign a piece of blame or misconduct to a karate instructor for teaching a child how to use hand to hand combat if they grew up and broke someone's neck with it? Or a driving instructor for teaching someone how to drive if they decided to run over someone? No offense, but the blame goes ONE place...the person who killed these innocent people.

Point taken.
 

GingerSnapsBack

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Unfortunately, she paid for her poor choice in judgment with her own life.

My dad taught me how to shoot before I could write my own name. Just because someone is around guns doesn't mean they're going to massacre an entire school full of children. I don't believe the mother has anything to do with this. Lots of parents want children to be comfortable around guns and have an understanding about how to use them. My sister was never the enthusiast that I am yet she knows how to properly handle and store guns out of reach of her kids.

The only one to blame here is the dead shooter. Not the guns. Not the man's parents. Not TV. Not radio. Not rappers. Not music. Not anything but himself. HE made the choice to do this.

I knew that a gun control debate was going to be in the works pretty soon. It's a given every time something like this happens. The politicians start pontificating that we need gun control laws and restricted sales. You can outlaw guns and try to restrict their use, but when was the last time some thug actually bought a gun legally before he jacked some woman's car?

The only ones that are hurt by gun control are people like me who legally purchased guns for personal protection.
 

kch50428

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I don't believe the mother has anything to do with this. (snip)

The only ones that are hurt by gun control are people like me who legally purchased guns for personal protection.

I'm going to disagree about mom... if here son was as troubled as reported - she had an obligation to make sure there was no way he could access her weapons... and if he really was as bad off has been suggested, her allowing him to be anywhere near any kind of weaponry and keeping them in the same house with him certainly raises questions...

And the whole "new" clamor about "gun control" is not so much about the gun, its about the control. As Charleton Heston said, "...From my cold, dead hand..."
 

Eileen89

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My dad taught me how to shoot before I could write my own name. Just because someone is around guns doesn't mean they're going to massacre an entire school full of children. I don't believe the mother has anything to do with this. Lots of parents want children to be comfortable around guns and have an understanding about how to use them. My sister was never the enthusiast that I am yet she knows how to properly handle and store guns out of reach of her kids.

The only one to blame here is the dead shooter. Not the guns. Not the man's parents. Not TV. Not radio. Not rappers. Not music. Not anything but himself. HE made the choice to do this.

I knew that a gun control debate was going to be in the works pretty soon. It's a given every time something like this happens. The politicians start pontificating that we need gun control laws and restricted sales. You can outlaw guns and try to restrict their use, but when was the last time some thug actually bought a gun legally before he jacked some woman's car?

The only ones that are hurt by gun control are people like me who legally purchased guns for personal protection.
Hold up a sec. I think you misunderstood my post. My post had to do with a mother of a "mentally unstable" individual who took her son out and taught her son how to use a gun. Had nothing to do with a mentally stable person keeping a gun for protection..... Sorry if you don't agree with this, but a mentally unbalanced person should not be around guns.....
 

Eileen89

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My nephew has depression, bi-polar disorder and mild schizophrenia...he's on medications and what not, and can be quite a challenge to deal with when he's having a manic mood. That said, I've taken him to the range with me (both of my nephews in fact), we've gone many times, and he's been respectful of the weapon, the rules and instruction when we've gone...to be honest, showing him how to handle a firearm is not going to turn him into a murderer and executioner...and i don't think it's fair at all to say that the mother some how made a poor choice in teaching her son how to shoot a gun at a firing range, she may have been trying to help him, trying to bond with him...and while yes, there are things you could do to bond without shooting guns, some people consider that as normal as watching a movie or having lunch.

He was psychotic and he murdered these kids and adults himself...not because his mom taught him how to shoot a gun. Would you assign a piece of blame or misconduct to a karate instructor for teaching a child how to use hand to hand combat if they grew up and broke someone's neck with it? Or a driving instructor for teaching someone how to drive if they decided to run over someone? No offense, but the blame goes ONE place...the person who killed these innocent people.
You and I will simply have to agree to disagree on this, Sean. Because I do think she made a poor choice and she paid for it. After all, she was murdered by her son who used her gun to kill her.
 

GingerSnapsBack

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I'd have to know when did this mental problem surface. How long did he have it? I haven't paid that much attention to the news to see how long he had it. If it was recent and she took him shooting, maybe. He still made his own bed though.

If mom took him out when he was a kid and then he developed the mental problem recently - that's where I have a problem. Even if he had this since childhood, there are plenty of people like Sean said that live lnear guns and don't go on a shooting spree. Yes, I do think guns should be kept locked up away from children or this can happen, but I'd hardly call a twenty year old a child.

I don't have kids and won't ever have kids, but I do think if my child was mentally unstable, I'd probably protect myself by keeping guns locked up. That I can agree with you on, but then again, he could have built a bomb or used a machete to do the same damage. What do you lock up around a mentally unhinged adult? Knives? Rocks? SUVs? Guns? Sticks? Hammers?

In any event, the mother is deceased. Blaming her won't help bring the parents of those children any comfort. Blaming the shooter won't help either, however, IMO, when the shooter is killed in situations like this, I'd much rather see him commit suicide or have death by cop than tie up thousands of dollars in court costs only to rot in prison for the rest of his life in a lifestyle that is probably better than some Americans.

Too bad letting an inmate like that loose in GenPop is illegal. He wouldn't last an hour.

The news said something about the dad being shot as well as the mother. Did that pan out? I heard it both ways as well as the shooter's brother was involved as well and the younger brother shot the older brother.
 
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Eileen89

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The news said something about the dad being shot as well as the mother. Did that pan out? I heard it both ways as well as the shooter's brother was involved as well and the younger brother shot the older brother.
I do not blame the mother for what her son did, I simply stated the facts. She taught her son how to use guns, and she was killed with one of her own guns. If someone else wants to blame her, I don't know, but it won't be me. As far as the Dad goes, it is my understanding the couple were divorced and he was no where around the shootings and therefore wasn't harmed. As far as the brother goes, the killer had his Brother from NJ ID on him which is why the police first thought he was the actual shooter. The Bother from NJ was not otherwise involved here in any way.
 

kch50428

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The news said something about the dad being shot as well as the mother. Did that pan out? I heard it both ways as well as the shooter's brother was involved as well and the younger brother shot the older brother.
Dad is alive & well - older brother was at work in NYC when his social media blew up telling him he was an evil SOB for shooting up a bunch of kids... turns out much of the media's "real time" reporting early on in the incident was flat out bovine processed feed grains.
 

phreddyl

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I do not blame the mother for what her son did, I simply stated the facts. She taught her son how to use guns, and she was killed with one of her own guns. If someone else wants to blame her, I don't know, but it won't be me. As far as the Dad goes, it is my understanding the couple were divorced and he was no where around the shootings and therefore wasn't harmed. As far as the brother goes, the killer had his Brother from NJ ID eon him which is why the police first thought he was the actual shooter. The Bother from NJ was not otherwise involved here in any way.

Where I think the mom has to bear some of the blame is not recognizing that her son was getting worse and getting him the proper care. This is something we all need to be better educated on. I also feel teaching to shoot is one thing. Having the guns in the house readily available to her mentally unstable son is another.

Also on a side note WBBC was not at the funeral today. The police presence was a help I'm sure.
 

kch50428

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Also on a side note WBBC was not at the funeral today. The police presence was a help I'm sure.
Good... I hope they stay away from all of them... and I wouldn't object if any Newtown citizenry taking up high powered floodlights to shine at media people and their cameras should the media become even more excessively annoying than they've already been.
 

anon(4698833)

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You and I will simply have to agree to disagree on this, Sean. Because I do think she made a poor choice and she paid for it. After all, she was murdered by her son who used her gun to kill her.

So you feel the mom was reckless in her actions of simply having firearms? We have no idea how secure these weapons were kept, for all we know, they were kept in a locked down safe and he was able to get into it and bypass the safeguards the mother put into place to prevent access PERIOD to them. How many times has a child done something that baffled you in how they figured out how to do it? I've watched my niece take the iPad at our house and unlock things on it that i personally thought were pretty well hidden within menus and inaccessible to a child...she goes right in and bam, instant access. She also remembered our alarm code for our condo simply because she always runs in with us when we disarm it and stands with us because the noise scares her...she's 8 years old and visually recognized the keys hit (and ended up turning it off for us one day to my complete shock!).

If these guns were just laying around...sure, I'd venture to say that'd be plain out negligence (though she is dead so what does it matter now?). But we don't know what the deal was, and going by the stories I've read and the fact that she was a teacher of small children, I'd just as easily assume she had them fully locked down vs. sitting out in the open.

Either way, i don't think putting ANY blame on the mom is called for...that's just my opinion. The lady was murdered by this same scum bag, god only knows why.
 

pkcable

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Just saw the coolest thing on The Voice, they started the show by having the contestants and the coaches sing Hallelujah, holding candles and each had signs with the names and age a victim. This manly man could not stop tears from flowing! Very nicely done The Voice! And they didn't mention it either, they just then went right in to the show, it was VERY classy. They just did the song and showed the names. :)

 
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anon(631531)

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So you feel the mom was reckless in her actions of simply having firearms? We have no idea how secure these weapons were kept, for all we know, they were kept in a locked down safe and he was able to get into it and bypass the safeguards the mother put into place to prevent access PERIOD to them. How many times has a child done something that baffled you in how they figured out how to do it? I've watched my niece take the iPad at our house and unlock things on it that i personally thought were pretty well hidden within menus and inaccessible to a child...she goes right in and bam, instant access. She also remembered our alarm code for our condo simply because she always runs in with us when we disarm it and stands with us because the noise scares her...she's 8 years old and visually recognized the keys hit (and ended up turning it off for us one day to my complete shock!).

If these guns were just laying around...sure, I'd venture to say that'd be plain out negligence (though she is dead so what does it matter now?). But we don't know what the deal was, and going by the stories I've read and the fact that she was a teacher of small children, I'd just as easily assume she had them fully locked down vs. sitting out in the open.

Either way, i don't think putting ANY blame on the mom is called for...that's just my opinion. The lady was murdered by this same scum bag, god only knows why.

Believe me, i'm not against guns. I'm a long time Life Member of the N.R.A, but i am against irresponsibility. We don't know if those guns were locked down, or not. We don't know that moron's reason for doing what he did, and we may never know. I'm giving my personal opinion...I would NEVER teach a person to shoot, if i knew that he had mental problems, and was taking or maybe not taking his meds. I would never condone what he did, but his mother, God rest her soul, must bare some of the responsibility for his actions. Sorry, if you don't agree with me, but that's how i feel.
 

phreddyl

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Believe me, i'm not against guns. I'm a long time Life Member of the N.R.A, but i am against irresponsibility. We don't know if those guns were locked down, or not. We don't know that moron's reason for doing what he did, and we may never know. I'm giving my personal opinion...I would NEVER teach a person to shoot, if i knew that he had mental problems, and was taking or maybe not taking his meds. I would never condone what he did, but his mother, God rest her soul, must bare some of the responsibility for his actions. Sorry, if you don't agree with me, but that's how i feel.

I agree with you. If we don't start taking responsibility for the mental health of our children and get them the help they need then this will continue to happen
 

anon(4698833)

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There have been ZERO details showing a negligent storage of the firearms, lack of mental therapy and counseling to the shooter or anything that shows some kind of "fault" on the mom's part. It's foolish to go off assumptions, even i feel a bit foolish assuming the weapons were stored properly...but what we know so far is this kid shot a bunch of innocent people, execution style and also murdered his mom. I'm not going to start pointing the finger at a woman who was murdered by this same sick piece of sh*t when there's nothing to promote such action...that's just me.
 

pkcable

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There have been ZERO details showing a negligent storage of the firearms, lack of mental therapy and counseling to the shooter or anything that shows some kind of "fault" on the mom's part. It's foolish to go off assumptions, even i feel a bit foolish assuming the weapons were stored properly...but what we know so far is this kid shot a bunch of innocent people, execution style and also murdered his mom. I'm not going to start pointing the finger at a woman who was murdered by this same sick piece of sh*t when there's nothing to promote such action...that's just me.


WhatEVER happened it was a sad sad day for all involved! I'm just praying for the lives of those lost and for peace for those around them, as difficult as that may be for them. Smarter folks than I can ask questions and look at stuff and make plans and help to prevent stuff like this in the future, but the sad truth is stuff like this will happen again, no matter what we do.
 

anon(631531)

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There have been ZERO details showing a negligent storage of the firearms, lack of mental therapy and counseling to the shooter or anything that shows some kind of "fault" on the mom's part. It's foolish to go off assumptions, even i feel a bit foolish assuming the weapons were stored properly...but what we know so far is this kid shot a bunch of innocent people, execution style and also murdered his mom. I'm not going to start pointing the finger at a woman who was murdered by this same sick piece of sh*t when there's nothing to promote such action...that's just me.

I'm not arguing with you Sean, but as you yourself say, so far there have been ZERO details released to the general public. Let's wait and see.:confused:
 

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