I’m noticing the 2.5x photo isn’t using the telephoto lens.

imwjl

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Re: 2.5x photo doesn't use the telephoto lens

He wasn't the only one who said that.

I waded into the YouTube mess of "experts" looking for case info but caught lots of garbage reviews. Few did the decent sort of analysis the way ARS Technica often does for one example. They're mostly about getting your attention for their ad and sponsor revenue.

It's not always, but at this point I've had several times when the Max doesn't go into the highly processed low light mode. Third part apps give you control of the cameras and files that can show a difference. A family hike aiming cameras across a bay showed 2.5 vs 2x zoom is a meaningful upgrade.

The differences might not be important to everyone but they exist. Holding the 6.7 next to 6.1 phones, 2.5 zoom and battery life make the Max a bargain and worth carrying for lots of people.
 
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Re: 2.5x photo doesn't use the telephoto lens

The differences might not be important to everyone but they exist. Holding the 6.7 next to 6.1 phones, 2.5 zoom and battery life make the Max a bargain and worth carrying for lots of people.

I'll give you better battery life but I have yet to see my 12PM use the telephoto lens at all when zooming 2.5x. it's really frustrating me and I've tried a few apps now and nothing seems to trigger the correct lens.

I really think I just need to return it and move to the regular 12. Photos will be pretty much the same anyway.
 

popkurn611

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Re: 2.5x photo doesn't use the telephoto lens

I'll give you better battery life but I have yet to see my 12PM use the telephoto lens at all when zooming 2.5x. it's really frustrating me and I've tried a few apps now and nothing seems to trigger the correct lens.

I really think I just need to return it and move to the regular 12. Photos will be pretty much the same anyway.

So, I’m curious to hear if you made any moves yet.
 
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Re: 2.5x photo doesn't use the telephoto lens

So, I’m curious to hear if you made any moves yet.

I did! I purchased the iPhone 12 in black. Just got it yesterday.

It seems like it's 95% of the phone the 12PM is, just a bit smaller, but otherwise, it's pretty much identical. Camera from what I can tell is equal to the 12PM, honestly can't tell a difference between the main and ultra-wide cameras. Maybe in low light the differences will be more apparent.

Telephoto isn't a big deal in the iPhone. Per this thread, the 2.5x telephoto lens doesn't seem to engage much anyway, so no big loss there.

TBH I'm still struggling with small things that I was used to on Android, and I honestly don't feel the iPhone takes images as good as the Pixel. But the iPhone 12 so far seems to be the best bang for buck iPhone 12 model at the moment. I don't think the 12PM is worth it, especially when the 12 is so good and is 95% of the phone for 70% of the cost.
 

popkurn611

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Re: 2.5x photo doesn't use the telephoto lens

I did! I purchased the iPhone 12 in black. Just got it yesterday.

It seems like it's 95% of the phone the 12PM is, just a bit smaller, but otherwise, it's pretty much identical. Camera from what I can tell is equal to the 12PM, honestly can't tell a difference between the main and ultra-wide cameras. Maybe in low light the differences will be more apparent.

Telephoto isn't a big deal in the iPhone. Per this thread, the 2.5x telephoto lens doesn't seem to engage much anyway, so no big loss there.

TBH I'm still struggling with small things that I was used to on Android, and I honestly don't feel the iPhone takes images as good as the Pixel. But the iPhone 12 so far seems to be the best bang for buck iPhone 12 model at the moment. I don't think the 12PM is worth it, especially when the 12 is so good and is 95% of the phone for 70% of the cost.

Awesome! I’m glad you got it to try it. I’m using the 12 in black as well and definitely think it is the model to buy this year. I had the telephoto on the 11 pro model, used it quite frequently actually and was worried I would miss it, but manually zooming in 2x for me basically results in the same exact end result.

It’s going to come down to what platform works better for you. I’d say, give yourself enough time to dive into the apple ecosystem. Once you do, it may sway your decision going back to Android. I’ve realized that iMessage, FaceTime, airdrop, handoff, iCloud backup/restore, and the Apple Watch have kept me from leaving Apple.
 

imwjl

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Re: 2.5x photo doesn't use the telephoto lens

I did! I purchased the iPhone 12 in black. Just got it yesterday.

It seems like it's 95% of the phone the 12PM is, just a bit smaller, but otherwise, it's pretty much identical. Camera from what I can tell is equal to the 12PM, honestly can't tell a difference between the main and ultra-wide cameras. Maybe in low light the differences will be more apparent.

Telephoto isn't a big deal in the iPhone. Per this thread, the 2.5x telephoto lens doesn't seem to engage much anyway, so no big loss there.

TBH I'm still struggling with small things that I was used to on Android, and I honestly don't feel the iPhone takes images as good as the Pixel. But the iPhone 12 so far seems to be the best bang for buck iPhone 12 model at the moment. I don't think the 12PM is worth it, especially when the 12 is so good and is 95% of the phone for 70% of the cost.

Your experience doesn't reflect the absolute reality that the Pro and Max cameras can make a very significant difference but it's fine if one model suits you better.

You should also be more specific re Pixel because there are a few models. You might also want to pursue some of the reviews comparing cameras and camera apps. It might be that your preference is a photo with a lot of saturation or contrast. Some phones are that way by default. Some apps might get you what you like at first shot. That really applies to several phone choices.
 

popkurn611

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Re: 2.5x photo doesn't use the telephoto lens

Your experience doesn't reflect the absolute reality that the Pro and Max cameras can make a very significant difference but it's fine if one model suits you better.

You should also be more specific re Pixel because there are a few models. You might also want to pursue some of the reviews comparing cameras and camera apps. It might be that your preference is a photo with a lot of saturation or contrast. Some phones are that way by default. Some apps might get you what you like at first shot. That really applies to several phone choices.

The fact of the matter is, there is not a very significant difference with the pro and max models. I had an 11 pro, got the 12 pro and returned it for the 12. I am most certainly not losing a significant amount in my quality of images. As a matter of fact, I'm about to now return the 12 and go back to my 11 pro. The upgrades this year don't warrant the upgrade for me and I'm sure a lot of others can agree.
 

imwjl

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Re: 2.5x photo doesn't use the telephoto lens

The fact of the matter is, there is not a very significant difference with the pro and max models. I had an 11 pro, got the 12 pro and returned it for the 12. I am most certainly not losing a significant amount in my quality of images. As a matter of fact, I'm about to now return the 12 and go back to my 11 pro. The upgrades this year don't warrant the upgrade for me and I'm sure a lot of others can agree.

More and more we use phone cameras in the enterprise where it would have been unheard of a few years ago. We have all the recent popular models from Apple, Samsung and Google among the marketing, content and IT staff.

It might not make a difference for a lot of use and especially casual or amateur use but the 2.5x zoom and more capable middle camera do stand out.
 

popkurn611

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Re: 2.5x photo doesn't use the telephoto lens

More and more we use phone cameras in the enterprise where it would have been unheard of a few years ago. We have all the recent popular models from Apple, Samsung and Google among the marketing, content and IT staff.

It might not make a difference for a lot of use and especially casual or amateur use but the 2.5x zoom and more capable middle camera do stand out.

To you they may, to many others they don't. I'm big into photography and always like having the best model, but as the years go on smartphone cameras are not gaining too many significant specs. Maybe once Apple gets 10x 30x and 100x like Samsung and other Android manufacturers have then we can start saying they are significant. Again, to each is own. I'm glad you find the camera upgrades significant.
 

imwjl

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Re: 2.5x photo doesn't use the telephoto lens

To you they may, to many others they don't. I'm big into photography and always like having the best model, but as the years go on smartphone cameras are not gaining too many significant specs. Maybe once Apple gets 10x 30x and 100x like Samsung and other Android manufacturers have then we can start saying they are significant. Again, to each is own. I'm glad you find the camera upgrades significant.

The amount of zoom or focal length are different than what the larger sensor can do. Even without using the larger sensor (Max middle cam) experimenting with family and associates showed the 2.5 12 Max camera got detail digitally zoomed photos didn't get.

It might be the way you and some use this stuff vocationally, but in my circle of infrastructure, tech and professional marketing content people the 12 PM really is significant and my only point is making sure that's understood. What's a diminishing return spend for some is a good business tool for others.
 

popkurn611

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Re: 2.5x photo doesn't use the telephoto lens

The amount of zoom or focal length are different than what the larger sensor can do. Even without using the larger sensor (Max middle cam) experimenting with family and associates showed the 2.5 12 Max camera got detail digitally zoomed photos didn't get.

It might be the way you and some use this stuff vocationally, but in my circle of infrastructure, tech and professional marketing content people the 12 PM really is significant and my only point is making sure that's understood. What's a diminishing return spend for some is a good business tool for others.

Fair enough! It's very subjective now a days. Glad you're enjoying your 12PM
 
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Re: 2.5x photo doesn't use the telephoto lens

Your experience doesn't reflect the absolute reality that the Pro and Max cameras can make a very significant difference but it's fine if one model suits you better.

You should also be more specific re Pixel because there are a few models. You might also want to pursue some of the reviews comparing cameras and camera apps. It might be that your preference is a photo with a lot of saturation or contrast. Some phones are that way by default. Some apps might get you what you like at first shot. That really applies to several phone choices.

Well I can't really tell much of a difference between the two phones. If they're different, I mean they might be *slightly* different. But even still, both the iPhone 12 and 12 Pro Max don't have cameras as good as the Pixel IMO. With the Pixel, it's literally point and shoot and the photo will turn out great. It's extremely difficult to get a bad photo out of the Pixel. I have a harder time getting a great shot out of the iPhones and the results to me don't look as good.

I hate that the camera and OS level stuff I'm finding difficult is bugging me that much and I'm considering going back to Android.
 

imwjl

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Re: 2.5x photo doesn't use the telephoto lens

Well I can't really tell much of a difference between the two phones. If they're different, I mean they might be *slightly* different. But even still, both the iPhone 12 and 12 Pro Max don't have cameras as good as the Pixel IMO. With the Pixel, it's literally point and shoot and the photo will turn out great. It's extremely difficult to get a bad photo out of the Pixel. I have a harder time getting a great shot out of the iPhones and the results to me don't look as good.

I hate that the camera and OS level stuff I'm finding difficult is bugging me that much and I'm considering going back to Android.

It's fine if you have favorites and prefer some programs and interfaces over others but again, there are explicit differences between the camera systems, the default processing, and they really do make a difference. There are some great reviews out there where you can see what I describe. Reviews where 1:1 crops are compared for example.

It's kind of like this. We have a car with 200 HP and 300 HP. I like driving my car with 200 HP but I'd be silly to say that makes the 100 more horsepower my wife has meaningless. I really like my smart phone camera and use it most but that doesn't take away the distinct differences and capabilities my SLR bodies and an L grade lens have.

Go with what makes you happy. I deal with Adroid vs Apple at a buy and manage it dozens at a time. There are some differences. There are ways to equal some of them too. Nothing touches the Apple desktop integration for example so I've used 3rd party camera apps to help me be satisfied with all of them. Go with what makes you happy and my only point is you and others are wrong about camera differences to people who know how to use the differences or who do where where it makes a difference.
 
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Re: 2.5x photo doesn't use the telephoto lens

Go with what makes you happy and my only point is you and others are wrong about camera differences to people who know how to use the differences or who do where where it makes a difference.

Well having used the 12 and 12 Pro Max now for a while, the camera differences between the two are marginal if at all noticeable. Sure there are tech differences but the end result is seemingly negligible. I would have thought with all the hype Apple made about the Pro's cameras, that there would have been a bigger difference between the 12 and 12PM. I mean what's the point of having all that new hardware if the end result is pretty much the same?

There's also the issue where the 12PM rarely engages the 2.5x telephoto lens and opts for digital zooming the main sensor - leading to quite poor images. I still haven't found a solution to this, to force the 2.5 telephoto to engage. I can't work out when the camera wants to engage the 2.5x lens either. Even in bright outdoor sunlight, the phone seems to stick to the main lens and just digitally zoom in.

And for the bunch of photos I've taken, I don't think I've seen an image I prefer on the iPhone 12 or 12 Pro Max over the Pixel. Something about how the Pixel manages sharpness, white balance, contrast, saturation etc just makes for a great shot every time.

So value for money, I think the iPhone 12 is the best with a camera system that is pretty much equal to the 12PM but with substantial cost savings.
 

imwjl

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Re: 2.5x photo doesn't use the telephoto lens

Well having used the 12 and 12 Pro Max now for a while, the camera differences between the two are marginal if at all noticeable. Sure there are tech differences but the end result is seemingly negligible. I would have thought with all the hype Apple made about the Pro's cameras, that there would have been a bigger difference between the 12 and 12PM. I mean what's the point of having all that new hardware if the end result is pretty much the same?

There's also the issue where the 12PM rarely engages the 2.5x telephoto lens and opts for digital zooming the main sensor - leading to quite poor images. I still haven't found a solution to this, to force the 2.5 telephoto to engage. I can't work out when the camera wants to engage the 2.5x lens either. Even in bright outdoor sunlight, the phone seems to stick to the main lens and just digitally zoom in.

And for the bunch of photos I've taken, I don't think I've seen an image I prefer on the iPhone 12 or 12 Pro Max over the Pixel. Something about how the Pixel manages sharpness, white balance, contrast, saturation etc just makes for a great shot every time.

So value for money, I think the iPhone 12 is the best with a camera system that is pretty much equal to the 12PM but with substantial cost savings.

Have you checked out any or all of Halide and other camera apps, RAW or the new proprietary RAW format? Are you outside of the US or someplace where you might be paying more than the appropriate 10% jump in price?

Again, it's fine for you to have personal preferences but I'm only trying to be fair and accurate for someone interested in the products. You are correct pointing out they're all great products but I do not understand your math, understanding of photography and phone use. For me in the US there was an approximately 10% jump for the Max phone. The sensor size, lens difference, battery life and screen size all get a jump that's commensurate or better.

My observations that match up with associates.

-Most of the times I use default app and seemingly all the times I use Halide or ProCam I get the longer focal length.
-For work documentation and personal interests the center camera doesn't go into the video/slow mode for a photo.
-The two cameras stand out for reach only the Max has and detail where light and dark makes for a challenging photograph.
-Late Friday I had battery left on a big project day when all the associates with other phones were plugging their phones in for charge.
-The 12 Pro Max has meant I no longer carry a more specialized camera for some work and personal interests.

All that's well worth the 10% more I paid even though it is a big heavy phone.

You need the OS and phone that makes you happy, and I hope you can understand how the Max phone differences are significant even if not for you.
 

imwjl

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Re: 2.5x photo doesn't use the telephoto lens

And for the bunch of photos I've taken, I don't think I've seen an image I prefer on the iPhone 12 or 12 Pro Max over the Pixel. Something about how the Pixel manages sharpness, white balance, contrast, saturation etc just makes for a great shot every time.

FYI, I am happy with the 3rd party apps I use, but know this one is both Android and Apple plus had an update for the Pro RAW feature. It could be a great way to truly compare your Pixel to an iPhone and if you still have the Max with I think almost 50% larger sensor see now much more data is in a .dng file from it.

https://www.momentprocam.com
 
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I do not understand your math, understanding of photography and phone use. For me in the US there was an approximately 10% jump for the Max phone. The sensor size, lens difference, battery life and screen size all get a jump that's commensurate or better.

For pricing I was comparing the 12 to the 12PM (which are the two iPhones I currently have). There's a substantial price difference between the two and the camera difference is negligible.

The hardware may be different, but the results are largely the same. And even then, they're both inferror to the Pixel phone I have in pretty much all conditions.

FYI, I am happy with the 3rd party apps I use, but know this one is both Android and Apple plus had an update for the Pro RAW feature. It could be a great way to truly compare your Pixel to an iPhone and if you still have the Max with I think almost 50% larger sensor see now much more data is in a .dng file from it.

https://www.momentprocam.com

I'm not interested in RAW images, I'm just interested in snapping an image and the output to be the best.

Due to this, from taking a *lot* of photos on all three phones, I've decided to return the iPhone 12 Pro Max, the 12 and return to Android. I just found the camera on the Pixel better than the iPhones and a few other quality of life issues were too much for me to stay with the iPhone.

The Pixel just straight up takes better photos. I find contrast is better, saturation, detail etc. It seems to take great photos first time every time, whereas with the iPhone I have to tweak and tap and retake photos to get something that's good. Particularly pictures of people, I found the skin tones more natural and more detailed. I think Google's wizardry with their camera software is just too good.
 
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popkurn611

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Re: 2.5x photo doesn't use the telephoto lens

For pricing I was comparing the 12 to the 12PM (which are the two iPhones I currently have). There's a substantial price difference between the two and the camera difference is negligible.

The hardware may be different, but the results are largely the same. And even then, they're both inferror to the Pixel phone I have in pretty much all conditions.



I'm not interested in RAW images, I'm just interested in snapping an image and the output to be the best.

Due to this, from taking a *lot* of photos on all three phones, I've decided to return the iPhone 12 Pro Max, the 12 and return to Android. I just found the camera on the Pixel better than the iPhones and a few other quality of life issues were too much for me to stay with the iPhone.

The Pixel just straight up takes better photos. I find contrast is better, saturation, detail etc. It seems to take great photos first time every time, whereas with the iPhone I have to tweak and tap and retake photos to get something that's good. Particularly pictures of people, I found the skin tones more natural and more detailed. I think Google's wizardry with their camera software is just too good.

I can't disagree with you on the Pixel taking the better photos. It's always been Google's strongest thing going for them. If photos are that important to you then you use what's best for you. I'm glad you took the plunge though into iOS and gave it a more than fair shot.

For me, I look at the whole picture. The iOS ecosystem as a whole for me is what keeps me using an iPhone. The camera is more than suitable, even though like you said the skin tones are slightly warmer than others. It's just the whole package that I cannot get using Android and for that, iOS is what works best for me and so many others. The iPhone, my Apple watch, airpods pro, iMac, iPad, and the list goes on. The seamless integration is amazing.

I did see that you weren't too happy with the pixel 5 hardware which is why you came over to iOS. Are you going back to the pixel 5? I actually had the pixel 4a and the 5. For the price...I LOVED the 4a. The 5 did not impress me for $700.
 
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I can't disagree with you on the Pixel taking the better photos. It's always been Google's strongest thing going for them. If photos are that important to you then you use what's best for you. I'm glad you took the plunge though into iOS and gave it a more than fair shot.

For me, I look at the whole picture. The iOS ecosystem as a whole for me is what keeps me using an iPhone. The camera is more than suitable, even though like you said the skin tones are slightly warmer than others. It's just the whole package that I cannot get using Android and for that, iOS is what works best for me and so many others. The iPhone, my Apple watch, airpods pro, iMac, iPad, and the list goes on. The seamless integration is amazing.

I did see that you weren't too happy with the pixel 5 hardware which is why you came over to iOS. Are you going back to the pixel 5? I actually had the pixel 4a and the 5. For the price...I LOVED the 4a. The 5 did not impress me for $700.

Yeah completely understand your comment about the ecosystem. The phone, watch, airpods etc all interact so well together, so definitely see the benefits of that. Plus, Apple take good care of you and offer excellent service/help with issues.

I actually managed to pick up a brand new Pixel 4XL for very cheap and I'm just using that. I wasn't impressed with the Pixel 5 and feel they cut too many corners for the price they charged, but a cheap Pixel 4XL works for me. The 2x telephoto actually engages the telephoto lens, and using both the iPhone 12PM and Pixel 4XL over the Xmas break with family/friends, the images out of the Pixel just turned out better. If I didn't care about the camera, I'd maybe keep the iPhone 12, but here were also just too many small OS stuff that I prefer on Android and couldn't get used to not having them on iOS.

Might try out iPhone again later down the track. Will be interesting to see how iOS evolves over time.
 

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