Apple cancelled my 5S order :(

[M.Rizk]

I've never seen so many idiots in one thread!!!

FYI, having a mobile phone and be connected to the Internet is considered *a necessity* in the EU, or "a common right", and there are many laws already based on this assumption!

The guy's upset and is looking for an answer, or a way to get what he wants - what's so wrong?! That's what forums are for, after all!

I'm from eastern Europe and I have a similar problem. If I buy the phone here, it will be TWICE more expensive than from USA. And, as any American would do - I'm looking for a way to obtain it for less cash; I'm looking for the best deal. Is that wrong??

The whole topic about "security" is a total bull****! Every parcel is INSURED! In fact, I have much LESS security for my shipments while they travel to my USA mail-forwarding address (provided by Access USA, MyUS.com - #1 International Shipping, Mail and Package Forwarding Service - MyUS.com) than AFTER that - from USA to my country (by DHL)! I had two (2) SegWays this way, more than 20 laptops, about ONE TON of books and CDs - NEVER missing anything! In which century you live in?!

Apple doesn't care will you receive your package or not, you stupid! It's not their business! That's the job of the parcel companies and their insurers! Fact is - the iPad and the Mac Book Pro I've ordered (and paid the same way) are on their way, already! The only reason they cancel the iPhones is that this is their POLICY at the moment! And the guy (and me too) is upset because it is a STUPID policy, that's it!

I was in the same situation 10 years ago when I've ordered my Prius and after 2 months they returned me back the money. "It is out of our policy for this region" they said from Toyota Europe in Belgium. So I friend of mine ordered the can on my name *in Estonia* and when it was ready, I went there, paid it and drove 3400 km through half Europe - back home! It was the first hybrid car, imported in my country. And also in Estonia. But instead of being proud of this I still feel disappointed to this day!

We live in a global market and such restrictions and senseless policies are not only archaic but also stupid and upsetting. After all, we all are Apple's customers and we deserve to be treated with equal respect! And placing regional restrictions is not a respectful treatment of your clients. Or holding the highest prices IN THE WORLD in one of the poorest countries (mine) - just because they doesn't give a **** about this market!!


P.S. having an iPhone may be a luxury in USA but obviously not in the rest of the world! So please, be *more tolerant* and open minded if you don't want to see more comments like this!

Finally someone understands me, that's how I feel exactly. Anyways I asked a friend of mine there to buy one for me and send it to my American Freight Forwarder too.

I am not sure how getting an iPhone in the US is considered luxury when it's 200$ with a 2 year contract (if you don't have 600$ in cash I don't think you can upgrade your smartphone yearly). Here where I live there is nothing called contract, you have to pay full prices for a SIM free unit, so getting the T-Mobile version from the US was the best choice for me, specially that I visit the US a lot and would love to have LTE there.


Sent from my iPhone 5S using iMore Forums mobile app

 

[wamsille]

Calling people in this thread idiots and asking for more tolerance is a tad hypocritical.

Apple doesn't care will you receive your package or not, you stupid! It's not their business!

Actually yes, they do care that the package goes to its intended recipient. Regardless of the point you are trying to make, assuming a company has no vested interest in making sure packages get delivered to their customers is asinine.

We live in a global market and such restrictions and senseless policies are not only archaic but also stupid and upsetting.

Right, but we also live in a delicately woven global society that with a misspoken word or out of context phrase could create a small war. Policies and procedures are in place for a reason. Whether this is convenient, inconvenient or incredibly stupid from your point of your is irrelevant. From your anecdotal evidence you have proven that there are workarounds present in the current system. How about politicking for changes in regulations rather than posturing in a message forum suggesting other people are intolerant? It has nothing to do with our worldly view or (if any) cultural bias Americans are commonly associated with.

OP - sorry to hear Apple canceled your order. It may be in their policy that they will not ship to a freight forwarder. As someone that works in procurement I can say that not shipping to a freight forwarder is a common policy. In industries I have been part of where regulation is key, I cannot go willy nilly and ship to a "friend" in the United States who will in turn ship the product overseas. There are agreements in place that would not only prevent such a shipment but likely terminate my contract as a customer.

Is there potentially some regulation that prevents a specific build of the iPhone from shipping overseas? I don't know, but I wouldn't be surprised if there are region specific builds just as there are network specific builds. (Verizon, Sprint)

But I want the one with all the additional bands!

That is your problem with Apple. Take up the arcane policy with them and see if they will be willing to change. I don't think Apple is going out of its way to punish consumers - they themselves may be limited in what they can offer for sale outside the US.

Before the accelerated blame game starts and Americans begin to be called stupid and intolerant compared to the forward-thinking and open-minded folks in the rest of the world, take a chill pill and realize your argument is over what we (surprisingly) consider a luxury item. You know, because we are fat, lazy and stupid after all. OP, I hope you eventually get your iPhone in a perfectly legal and ethical way.

 

[wamsille]

I am not sure how getting an iPhone in the US is considered luxury when it's 200$ with a 2 year contract (if you don't have 600$ in cash I don't think you can upgrade your smartphone yearly). Here where I live there is nothing called contract, you have to pay full prices for a SIM free unit, so getting the T-Mobile version from the US was the best choice for me, specially that I visit the US a lot and would love to have LTE there.

Sent from my iPhone 5S using iMore Forums mobile app

Cellular service contracts are a carry over from the initial roll-out of wireless technology across the United States. Because spectrum is at a premium and keeping the network up and running requires constant maintenance, in order to keep the machine going people are tied into multi-year agreements.

side note: Before I'm challenged with the rebuttal that the wireless networks in the US are behind those in other parts of the world, that is not the issue here and should not overtake a thread about Apple's policy towards not shipping to a freight forwarder.

I digress. Since there is no real benefit in signing a contract for the customer, the 'what's in it for me / WIIFM' is a subsidized phone from the carrier.

You aren't really paying $200 on contract for a phone. You are paying:

a) Typically (not always) a $36 activation fee
b) A monthly rate equal to greater than $20-70$, most times not including the data plan
c) Taxes, fees, surcharges
d) A termination fee of around $300 - $400, which goes down by an incremental amount for each month of service under the agreement you have fulfilled

If you want the phone but not the contract, you are more than welcome to go month to month. That is an option.

People in the US do not need cell phones. We choose to procure them because they offer value and/or we want them. It is not a right but a privilege. Same as driving - accept any ***** can go out and buy a phone. You still have to take a test in order to get a license.

 

[M.Rizk]

Cellular service contracts are a carry over from the initial roll-out of wireless technology across the United States. Because spectrum is at a premium and keeping the network up and running requires constant maintenance, in order to keep the machine going people are tied into multi-year agreements.

side note: Before I'm challenged with the rebuttal that the wireless networks in the US are behind those in other parts of the world, that is not the issue here and should not overtake a thread about Apple's policy towards not shipping to a freight forwarder.

I digress. Since there is no real benefit in signing a contract for the customer, the 'what's in it for me / WIIFM' is a subsidized phone from the carrier.

You aren't really paying $200 on contract for a phone. You are paying:

a) Typically (not always) a $36 activation fee
b) A monthly rate equal to greater than $20-70$, most times not including the data plan
c) Taxes, fees, surcharges
d) A termination fee of around $300 - $400, which goes down by an incremental amount for each month of service under the agreement you have fulfilled

If you want the phone but not the contract, you are more than welcome to go month to month. That is an option.

People in the US do not need cell phones. We choose to procure them because they offer value and/or we want them. It is not a right but a privilege. Same as driving - accept any ***** can go out and buy a phone. You still have to take a test in order to get a license.

The spectrum is premium everywhere and you get to pay connection fees, but not all countries have contracts as those who don't just offer the devices at full price (which is usually much more expensive than the US iPhone off contract price).

I know what the contract price is divided into, and regarding a termination fee you should not terminate it if you are not going to keep it. Anyways the termination fee is just 400. Now 400 + 200 is equal to 600, which is the off contract price and that is fair, really fair. If it was my country and we had contracts you would have paid much more as a penalty for early termination that will cost much more than an off contract phone, but in the US it just acts as if you got your phone on a two months installments.

Here an iPhone 5S 32 GB is offered for about 958$, that's the iPhone 5S 32 GB off contract price in the US including taxes and a 2 years of Apple Care +. Also the US model offers much more spectrums, including ones that I need as I said earlier I do come to the US in summer on a yearly basis and would be more than happy to have LTE there.

You're asking me, or all of us to deal with Apple in a certain way so that they change their policy. Well, Apple doesn't even have a store where I live. They are partnered with carriers only and carriers claim that it costs more to get it here as it comes unlocked, well my T-Mobile 5S is unlocked so their statement is now invalid.

Apple yes does have a policy that doesn't allow shipments to freight forwarders but I am sorry, I won't respect a policy that Apple itself doesn't follow. Yes, I have tried to buy many accessories of Apple.com US website including the 5S Leather case, and Apple TV. Apple shipped both to my freight forwarder address in just about 24 hours, why didn't they do the same as they did with the iPhone I ordered then?! It's because they only apply it when they feel like it.

One more reason I got the iPhone from Apple.com US is that no one in my country respects the warranty and if anything happens to your phone carriers will always claim that the issue is not included in warranty (unless it's a software restore) and will charge you a luxury premium price for it, and there is a chance they will use non genius parts if they need to replace anything!

This happened with my MacBook Pro which was bought from Qatar, a keyboard key got broken and they refused in Qatar to fix it for free. I had only a week left till I travel to the US so I gave it to Apple Store in San Francisco and they fixed it in under 3 days FOR FREE! That's why I got my iPhone from the US with Apple Care + so that if anything bad happens to it, I would be able to fix it when I got to the US in summer, or have a replacement.


Sent from my iPhone 5S using iMore Forums mobile app

 

[wamsille]

In the end you received your iPhone 5S and it is unlocked. You got everything you wanted sans the higher pricing despite the hiccups from Apple. As for the inconsistencies in how their policy is applied, I cannot be certain why one order is rejected whereas another is shipped out. You mention that there isn't an Apple store in your area and that Apple is only working with the carriers.

Think about that for a moment.

Instead of cannibalizing sales and negating agreements that Apple has in place with carriers in the region, they are refusing to ship to freight forwarders. So what is wrong with that? The price? Sure, the price may be higher than what you are willing to pay by several hundred dollars. (ouch) Fact is, this is the negotiated pricing between Apple and the carriers based on any number of factors. Perhaps Apple is greedy, or there is additional expense to certify to specifications for your regional carriers. Perhaps your carrier is greedy, or they make little money from equipment sales and need to generate revenue since no one is "locked in" to a provider.

Edit:

Is it then fair to speculate that there is more to the policies and procedures in place?

Carrier - Apple, I want to sell your iPhone on my network.

Apple - Sure! We'd be delighted to support your network.

Carrier - Yeah, but here's the catch. We know consumers could easily get an unlocked model to use on our network from you directly. Could you restrict delivery outside the US to prevent people from taking advantage of the currency exchange rates?

Apple - Of course. We want to partner with you and while we would appreciate the direct fulfilment there is more to being in business than making money.

 

[TiredOfPhoneWar]

Its normal because your zip code on card and adress isnt match,dont take it so personally my friend thats how the things work, good luck.

 

[wamsille]

Its normal because your zip code on card and adress isnt match,dont take it so personally my friend thats how the things work, good luck.

That's not his issue - the issue is that Apple would not ship to the freight forwarder since his billing address is outside the US. Yes, technically the ship to and the bill to addresses did not match up and normally that isn't a big deal. (Folks buy gifts all the time) The issue is Apple identified the address as a freight forwarder and blocked the sale.

As the OP and another user have stated, this "policy" is not applied consistently. (I actually think that it is, hence the embargo on iPhones versus other electronics). They have other products they have bought with little or no issue but I think what they don't understand is that if Apple has no store presence and is working with the regional carriers they will not cannibalize those sales by fulfilling orders direct.

 

[TiredOfPhoneWar]

I have the same problem, but I made order to address of my friend. And the apple was canceled this order. I really don't know whats wrong.

You should use the credit card of your friend and pay him in cash. My friend pay me for amazon USA since they dont ship to canada, so he buys with his name and card and give it to me

 

[TiredOfPhoneWar]

That's not his issue - the issue is that Apple would not ship to the freight forwarder since his billing address is outside the US. Yes, technically the ship to and the bill to addresses did not match up and normally that isn't a big deal. (Folks buy gifts all the time) The issue is Apple identified the address as a freight forwarder and blocked the sale.

As the OP and another user have stated, this "policy" is not applied consistently. (I actually think that it is, hence the embargo on iPhones versus other electronics). They have other products they have bought with little or no issue but I think what they don't understand is that if Apple has no store presence and is working with the regional carriers they will not cannibalize those sales by fulfilling orders direct.

You can help him if you are in the us and then send him the iphone

 

[iEd]

Getting a iPhone is not a human right.

Apple is a business and if they choose not to ship to a particular type of address then that's what it is.
If someone doesn't like how they do business then don't do business with them.


#Naked Tuesday

 

[wamsille]

You can help him if you are in the us and then send him the iphone

Are we participating in the same thread? Serious question.

 

[TiredOfPhoneWar]

Are we participating in the same thread? Serious question.

Yes i just try to be nice cos in reality apple has the right to cancel the order and debating about it is not really help

 

[wamsille]

@Karenkcoulter

Exactly my point from the previous page. Logistically speaking, Apple is going to go with a low-cost alternative when servicing markets where they do not currently have a physical presence. Does it stink that you cannot free and clear buy a phone from Apple direct based on your geographical location? Yes. But, odds are they are contractually obligated to restrict shipments outside the US. So should Apple break a contract just to make you happy?

Also, think of the embargos that get placed all the time when the HTC's and Samsungs of the world sue or get sued for various patent infringement cases or intellectual property issues.

 

[dalaen]

There are model restrictions geographically talking.

I asked Apple to replace the European iPhone 5s with the American model. The guy told me on phone he'd try everything to achieve this, but the service just didn't allow this.
There was no reason specified, but we just both guessed the American Model is not allowed to be sold out of the US.

 

[anon(4698833)]

blah blah blah blah blah

You know, for someone with a single post in this community asking for "tolerance", coming into the thread and calling people idiots and stupid seems awful hypocritical.

At any rate, I think you both could use a tutorial in the difference between necessity and luxury when it comes to these devices...show me one piece of evidence that says you MUST have an iPhone as your cellular device. I'll be waiting...forever. You say that in Europe, internet access and having a mobile phone is a "common right"...in what way does this equate to the iPhone being a necessity? That'd be like me saying I have a common right to public transportation, so they better allot me a BMW X5 as such...that's asinine, and just as ridiculous and pretending the iPhone is a necessity.

And then you go on and on and on about how this and that is "BS"...how is it bullsh*t when Apple is simply adhering to their own regulations on shipping a product? They don't owe you anything...they have a rule, if you don't follow it, you don't get the product. It's a pretty black and white situation here, regardless of your opinions and generic assumptions about the world of shipping works, I'm going to safely guess than there is a reason Apple doesn't do it, but even if there wasn't, even if Apple simply did it so M.Rizk couldn't have an iPhone and NO other reason...they're a business, and therefore, if that is their decision, DEAL WITH IT. Order the device how you're supposed to...if your country or region of the world is too expensive for you to where you want to enjoy the benefits of living in the United States...MOVE. Become a citizen here, enjoy our ways of life in this regard...otherwise, DEAL WITH IT.

You don't like the pricing of products in your country? MOVE. You don't like the shipping techniques afforded to your region? MOVE. You feel like the world owes you equality, respect and the same opportunity as the next guy regardless of what you put into the equation? COME BACK TO REALITY.

I feel like I'm debating this with a teenager with a bad case of entitlement. I mean seriously? How is it Apple's fault that it costs them more to get an iPhone to you so YOU have to pay for it? Show me a "global market" business that doesn't practice these kinds of things? You can't, because there are none.

I'm seriously just baffled at the entitlement issues I see these days. People feel like the world owes them...well...THE WORLD. Get over yourselves. And if you want tolerance, you should practice what you preach. Not a solid start there with your lowly entry to the community buddy.

 

[wamsille]

You don't like the pricing of products in your country? MOVE. You don't like the shipping techniques afforded to your region? MOVE. You feel like the world owes you equality, respect and the same opportunity as the next guy regardless of what you put into the equation? COME BACK TO REALITY.

You take one step forward but two steps back in this argument. Clearly they disapprove of the policies in place, but they aren't fully read on the subject so their stance on the matter appears uneducated and entitled. But, to suggest that the means to an end is moving to a country where the pricing and shipping is not an issue is a little asinine itself.

This thread

1. Does nothing to further the conversation of any company's refusal to ship outside of their country of origin
2. Explain why a company such as Apple does not offer direct fulfillment, as is the case with the original poster's claim
3. Should be considered a lesson in how not to get your point across regarding a subject

 

[anon(4698833)]

There's really no argument at all to take any steps in any direction...there are people who feel entitled to have something they cannot through a method that is not available to them (obviously). Apple doesn't refuse to ship outside their country of origin...Apple refuses to ship using certain METHODS outside their country of origin. Big difference.

My point was clear, and you understood it (as well as the others)...whether you liked it or not, I couldn't really care less...my suggestion that they move out of their country was a bit tongue in cheek, if you took it literally, that's on you, I'm not going to try and walk you through my entire retort hand in hand.

Thanks for making a list though, are you being paid for your role as his vocal representative here? lol...

 

[wamsille]

Actually, it had less to do with the shipping method (a freight forwarder) and the potential for there being issues with carrier exclusivity in the area the OP is located in. Granted, the shipping destination (a freight forwarder) is usually a no-no for most businesses.

And no, you don't have to hold my hand and guide me through your explanation. I was looking more towards the civil approach of diffusing the situation versus falling into the stereotype that many Americans get lumped into that we are a 'like it or leave it' nation and that is our stance with everything. Things happen for a reason and I suspect we don't have all of the supporting facts for the points brought up here. We probably never will and I'm cool with that.

It's a crime that I am not being compensated for my time and effort. Just mail the check to

edited to remove personal address

 

[anon(4698833)]

Actually, it had less to do with the shipping method (a freight forwarder) and the potential for there being issues with carrier exclusivity in the area the OP is located in. Granted, the shipping destination (a freight forwarder) is usually a no-no for most businesses.

And no, you don't have to hold my hand and guide me through your explanation. I was looking more towards the civil approach of diffusing the situation versus falling into the stereotype that many Americans get lumped into that we are a 'like it or leave it' nation and that is our stance with everything. Things happen for a reason and I suspect we don't have all of the supporting facts for the points brought up here. We probably never will and I'm cool with that.

It's a crime that I am not being compensated for my time and effort. Just mail the check to 1060 W Addison St, Chicago, IL 60613.

So you have proof that the carrier exclusivity was the overriding factor in the cancellation of his order? Or is that just an assumption?

Personally, I have no feeling of obligation to be "civil" or diffusive when it comes to A.) A person who blames a company like Apple because their work around didn't actually work and they'd have to go through standard procedures (for their area) to order the device...or B.) A kid who comes on here screaming "IDIOTS! YOU'RE STUPID!" on his first post in some odd attempt at campaign for tolerance, lol. Forgive me, but when a person complains that they aren't afforded the same things another person is just because they exist, it is quite hard not to shove the "like it or leave it" stance in their face.

Truth be told, I don't mind being "that" American at all honestly. If a person wants what you have, let them work for it in some way...I'm frankly sick of the "Everyone is Equal!" society that is growing in such numbers...everyone is NOT equal, everyone does NOT deserve a gold medal, everyone does NOT deserve to win all the time. But before I continue on that tangent, I'll just end it here by saying that I'd love to go to another country (germany for instance) and buy a nice BMW without the inflated cost I see here in the United States, and if there was a way to do it, I would...but I'm not going to sit and sh*t on BMW when I figure out that I can't get around it, as if they isolated me out from the bunch and shook their finger at me with a resounding "NO!"...nope, I'll get it through the means available to me, and if I can't afford to do so, why should I feel entitled to it?

 

[wamsille]

Do you want a trophy for that post?