1. SeanHRCC's Avatar
    I walked into two different stores and bought gold ones each time...the stores in my area have plenty of stock, and even some gold ones...EVERY DAY.

    You're spewing non-sense. I don't even think you understand what your own point is anymore.
    10-28-2013 09:44 PM
  2. Auturi's Avatar
    I walked into two different stores and bought gold ones each time...the stores in my area have plenty of stock, and even some gold ones...EVERY DAY.

    You're spewing non-sense. I don't even think you understand what your own point is anymore.
    Gold 5s every day? That's unheard of but congrats. I guess no one from your area is on the giant backlog list.

    But back to the original point, I shouldn't have been waking up every day reading a whole bunch of nonsense about the 5C. No one knows how much it sells, and it doesn't even matter.

    And for my closing statement, I'll just say this:

    The 5C is comparable to the 5S. They are pretty much on the same playing field. If it wasn't, I wouldn't have bought one.
    10-28-2013 09:52 PM
  3. jmr1015's Avatar
    Hmm. That's great that you found that. But I was never going to take a chance on buying a T-Mobile iPhone. I don't do carriers. Especially not T-Mobile.
    The carrier doesn't matter unless it is locked to that carrier. What is more important, is which model iPhone it is, and which bands that model supports. Where you plan to use the iPhone and what carriers you plan to use it on are the important question, as the answer will tell you which iPhone model you need to buy.

    So if the T-Mobile version supports the same bands as the SIM-Free version, what is the technological difference besides it being sold as a "T-Mobile Contract Free" version?

    Model A1533 (GSM)*: UMTS/HSPA+/DC-HSDPA (850, 900, 1700/2100, 1900, 2100 MHz); GSM/EDGE (850, 900, 1800, 1900 MHz); LTE (Bands 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 8, 13, 17, 19, 20, 25)

    Model A1533 (CDMA)*: CDMA EV-DO Rev. A and Rev. B (800, 1700/2100, 1900, 2100 MHz); UMTS/HSPA+/DC-HSDPA (850, 900, 1700/2100, 1900, 2100 MHz); GSM/EDGE (850, 900, 1800, 1900 MHz); LTE (Bands 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 8, 13, 17, 19, 20, 25)

    Model A1453*: CDMA EV-DO Rev. A and Rev. B (800, 1700/2100, 1900, 2100 MHz); UMTS/HSPA+/DC-HSDPA (850, 900, 1700/2100, 1900, 2100 MHz); GSM/EDGE (850, 900, 1800, 1900 MHz); LTE (Bands 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 8, 13, 17, 18, 19, 20, 25, 26)

    Model A1457*: UMTS/HSPA+/DC-HSDPA (850, 900, 1900, 2100 MHz); GSM/EDGE (850, 900, 1800, 1900 MHz); LTE (Bands 1, 2, 3, 5, 7, 8, 20)

    Model A1530*: UMTS/HSPA+/DC-HSDPA (850, 900, 1900, 2100 MHz); GSM/EDGE (850, 900, 1800, 1900 MHz); FDD-LTE (Bands 1, 2, 3, 5, 7, 8, 20); TD-LTE (Bands 38, 39, 40)
    10-28-2013 09:57 PM
  4. SeanHRCC's Avatar
    Gold 5s every day? That's unheard of but congrats. I guess no one from your area is on the giant backlog list.

    But back to the original point, I shouldn't have been waking up every day reading a whole bunch of nonsense about the 5C. No one knows how much it sells, and it doesn't even matter.

    And for my closing statement, I'll just say this:

    The 5C is comparable to the 5S. They are pretty much on the same playing field. If it wasn't, I wouldn't have bought one.
    lol...and who are you? Who cares what your opinion is of the 5S...or how close it is. There's a list of facts that go against your opinion, so you go ahead and pretend like your choice is some end all, be all statement about the devices...nobody cares.

    Also, people all over the world are walking into stores and getting gold 5S's...it's not just me.
    asdai likes this.
    10-28-2013 10:04 PM
  5. jmr1015's Avatar
    LOL, that's nice. But let me tell you why I wouldn't of took a chance on getting that. We don't know what they do to these phones, do you mean to tell me that the T-Mobile contract free version is it made to work on T-Mobile only, is it really an unlocked phone? With all of the LTE bands to go with it? Last I heard, with the T-Mobile version of the iPhone it was only working with T-Mobile and you couldn't use it outside of the U.S. it was incapable of international LTE.

    I just like to play by the rules when it comes to unlocked phones, I really wanted the Apple branded SIM free unlocked phone. If you go to the Apple Store and ask for an unlocked phone they're going to tell you that the T-Mobile version is not sold as unlocked. They're not going to sell it to you as such.

    And I'm not even going to get into trying to get the Verizon or AT&T or Sprint unlocked phones, because you know how horribly contrived that would be. It's not even an option.
    From the Apple website, in regards to the T-Mobile contract free iPhone 5S

    "If you buy iPhone for T-Mobile, it will arrive with a nano-SIM card already installed that you can activate by visiting an Apple Retail Store or a T-Mobile store or by calling T-Mobile. When you travel internationally, you can use a nano-SIM card for iPhone 5s from a local GSM carrier. For details on LTE support, see Apple - iPhone 5 - View countries with supported LTE networks.."

    So, yes it does indeed work outside of the US and overseas.

    From the link about details for LTE support:
    The T-Mobile contract free iPhone 5S has to be Model A1533 (GSM), which supports the following LTE Bands:
    1 (2100 MHz)
    2 (1900 MHz)
    3 (1800 MHz)
    4 (AWS)
    5 (850 MHz)
    8 (900 MHz)
    13 (700c MHz)
    17 (700b MHz)
    19 (800 MHz)
    20 (800 DD)
    25 (1900 MHz)

    and the following carriers in the following countries:
    United States
    Aio
    Alaska Communications
    AT&T
    Family Mobile
    GCI
    T-Mobile
    Verizon

    Canada
    Bell (including Virgin)
    MTS
    Rogers (including Fido)
    SaskTel
    Telus (including Koodo)

    Puerto Rico
    AT&T
    Claro
    T-Mobile
    10-28-2013 10:09 PM
  6. iEd's Avatar
    And let me guess, you got the space gray. That's because statistically, if someone says they walked to the store and got a 5s, chances are it wasn't a gold one. Because most stores did not get any gold at all.

    You don't know the full story of what I actually did to try to get these phones but the fact of the matter is that there is no unlocked iPhone 5s Sim free that Apple is selling right now.

    But I do have to take into consideration that most people actually do get iPhones on contracts. And most people actually don't buy unlocked phones so it's not really that big of an issue. For me, it is because I'm a business person and travel all the time.

    I don't usually deal with carrier contracts, but even if I decided to try going onto a contract to get the 5S I would feel severely disappointed, and then what would I do when the iPhone 6 came out?
    I got the Space Grey because that's what I wanted. I had no intention from the day it drop to get Gold or Silver. Gold or Silver is not my thing. They look fantastic but not my thing.

    If you got into a contract and next year the 6 comes out do what I do...... Wait for the 6s.





    #Naked Tuesday
    10-28-2013 10:10 PM
  7. Auturi's Avatar
    Okay great information we've gathered here. We found out a lot in this thread. That being said, I do want to say that people will choose what they can get their hands on and what fits for them. And I would say that a lot of people wouldn't be able to rock the 5C it just doesn't go with their style because they are colorful. But I like that flair.

    Now you have the 5S which is the more forward-thinking phone. We're still waiting for some apps and new technologies that will be able to unlock the A7 use of the phone and I'd like to see some apps that are only compatible with the 5S but not the 5C. Then I would really want to get that phone.

    I don't really understand why someone would have to get a T-Mobile version of an iPhone to have it unlocked. I don't know why they got rid of the Sim free version, but I guess that's a topic for another discussion but I think we're done here.
    10-28-2013 10:17 PM
  8. iEd's Avatar
    Okay great information we've gathered here. We found out a lot in this thread. That being said, I do want to say that people will choose what they can get their hands on and what fits for them. And I would say that a lot of people wouldn't be able to rock the 5C it just doesn't go with their style because they are colorful. But I like that flair.

    Now you have the 5S which is the more forward-thinking phone. We're still waiting for some apps and new technologies that will be able to unlock the A7 use of the phone and I'd like to see some apps that are only compatible with the 5S but not the 5C. Then I would really want to get that phone.

    I don't really understand why someone would have to get a T-Mobile version of an iPhone to have it unlocked. I don't know why they got rid of the Sim free version, but I guess that's a topic for another discussion but I think we're done here.



    #Naked Tuesday
    10-28-2013 10:19 PM
  9. jmr1015's Avatar
    I don't really understand why someone would have to get a T-Mobile version of an iPhone to have it unlocked. I don't know why they got rid of the Sim free version, but I guess that's a topic for another discussion but I think we're done here.
    As stated elsewhere in this thread, you don't have to buy the T-Mobile version to have it unlocked. If you buy any carriers version of the iPhone full price, you can have it unlocked.

    Also, as I've stated though the links and data provided, the T-Mobile contract free version is the GSM version. Same as any other GSM version of the iPhone. Model A1533 (GSM)

    If you can provide evidence that the T-Mobile version is physically/technologically different than any other GSM version, please fell free to present it. Otherwise, it is safe to assume that the AT&T, T-Mobile, or SIM-Free iPhone 5S are all Model A1533 (GSM) and support all the LTE bands and carrier networks stated earlier.
    10-28-2013 10:27 PM
  10. Auturi's Avatar
    As stated elsewhere in this thread, you don't have to buy the T-Mobile version to have it unlocked. If you buy any carriers version of the iPhone full price, you can have it unlocked.

    Also, as I've stated though the links and data provided, the T-Mobile contract free version is the GSM version. Same as any other GSM version of the iPhone. Model A1533 (GSM)

    If you can provide evidence that the T-Mobile version is physically/technologically different than any other GSM version, please fell free to present it. Otherwise, it is safe to assume that the AT&T, T-Mobile, or SIM-Free iPhone 5S are all Model A1533 (GSM) and support all the LTE bands and carrier networks stated earlier.
    But if a carrier gets their hands on it, they can have it to where it will never be unlocked. That's the whole reason I was forced to get another iPhone.
    10-28-2013 10:31 PM
  11. SeanHRCC's Avatar
    You keep ignoring an answer to your question about the SIM free, unlocked iPhone from Apple...they didn't get rid of anything, they simply haven't started selling it yet (which is the same thing they do EVERY SINGLE YEAR).
    10-28-2013 10:32 PM
  12. Auturi's Avatar
    You keep ignoring an answer to your question about the SIM free, unlocked iPhone from Apple...they didn't get rid of anything, they simply haven't started selling it yet (which is the same thing they do EVERY SINGLE YEAR).
    Except for the 5C apparently. Funny thing was, it (the SIM free 5S) was on the website on launch day, but then they took it down.

    Either way, too late now I mean I could still be waiting for that unlocked 5S but I wasn't going to do it. The 5C is ripe for the buying.
    10-28-2013 10:40 PM
  13. jmr1015's Avatar
    They might be the same model. But if a carrier gets their hands on if, they can have it to where it will never be unlocked. That's the whole reason I was forced to get another iPhone.
    No a carrier cannot "have it to where it will never be unlocked"

    A carrier can refuse to unlock a phone already locked to their network, for reasons each carrier will have listed on their respective website. Each carrier has stipulations you must meet to be eligible to unlock a device locked to their network.
    10-28-2013 10:50 PM
  14. Auturi's Avatar
    No a carrier cannot "have it to where it will never be unlocked"

    A carrier can refuse to unlock a phone already locked to their network, for reasons each carrier will have listed on their respective website. Each carrier has stipulations you must meet to be eligible to unlock a device locked to their network.
    Exactly. And it will be hell trying to get the carrier to unlock it for you . You get caught up in their ever changing and convoluted stipulations. You can read about these situations all over the Internet.

    Someone says all that matters is the model number and not the carrier it's under, the carrier makes all the difference. I wouldn't even go there.

    I would never buy a phone on a contract.
    10-28-2013 10:54 PM
  15. jmr1015's Avatar
    Exactly. And it will be hell trying to get the carrier to unlock it for you . You get caught up in their ever changing and convoluted stipulations. You can read about these situations all over the Internet.
    It is far from hell getting a carrier to unlock a device for you. The stipulations really aren't complicated. AT&T for example:

    You must meet the following requirements to unlock an AT&T wireless device:
    The person requesting the unlock code must be one of the following:
    -A current AT&T customer
    -A former AT&T customer who can provide the phone number or account number for the account
    -Your device was designed for use on AT&T's network.
    -Your device must be paid for in full.
    -Your device wasn't reported lost or stolen.

    In addition: Current AT&T customers are allowed up to five device unlocks per account, per year. Former customers are allowed a total of five device unlocks per former account.

    Pretty straight forward to me. I've never had trouble unlocking my previous iPhones.
    10-28-2013 11:04 PM
  16. jmr1015's Avatar
    That's fine. But I have different needs. I can't stay in one place for two years and use the same carrier. And there have been issues, many, with getting those unlocks. But that's not my problem.
    1) what needs might those be.
    2) no where has anyone or any of the literature posted said you need to stay in one place for two years and use the same carrier.

    as stated on AT&Ts website

    -Your device must be paid for in full.
    If you pay for a device in full, you are not on a 2-year contract. Ergo, you do not need to stay with that carrier for two years.

    and 3) most people having trouble unlocking phones are buying used phones, stolen phones, or phones from people who got them subsidized and on contract as an upgrade, and sold it for near full price for a profit over the subsidized price. I've have seen very few instances of people buying phones brand new and full price, and carriers refusing to unlock them.

    and again, this all shouldn't even apply to T-Mobile contract free iPhones sold directly from Apple. It should come unlocked already.
    10-28-2013 11:34 PM
  17. jmr1015's Avatar
    Okay. We're going too far off topic, we have to reel it back in.

    A real product launch failure would be something that they would want to discontinue. Or maybe there's just not enough room in this town for both of the iPhones.

    Who knows.

    I don't want to say that anyone is wrong. I mean, the numbers were never revealed.

    Maybe we'll never see the 5c again. Maybe Apple is hiding a colossal secret.
    Many places have reported the 5S is outselling the 5C at a margin of 2-to-1. Apple announced they sold 9 million iPhones release weekend. Simple extrapolation would lead us to around 3 million iPhone 5Cs release weekend.

    Also, reports estimated around 2.2 million iPhone 5C preorders. More than the iPhone 5 last year.

    Apple also announced 38 million total iPhone sales for the quarter. That means over a third of total iPhone sales for the entire fiscal quarter can be attributed to the 5S & 5C... just over the launch weekend, since 9 million alone were moved over release weekend. I'm sure many millions more were moved between then, and the end of the quarter about a week later.

    In short, many companies would kill for one of their devices to "fail" as much as the iPhone 5C. 3 million phones over a weekend is nothing to sneeze at.
    Fausty82, Alik Malix and Just_Me_D like this.
    10-28-2013 11:50 PM
  18. Auturi's Avatar
    Okay. We're going too far off topic, we have to reel it back in.

    A real product launch failure would be something that they would want to discontinue. Or maybe there's just not enough room in this town for both of the iPhones.

    Who knows.

    One of us is wrong and one of us is right but we can't say because the numbers were never revealed.

    Maybe we'll never see the 5c again. Maybe the iPhone 6 will be more like the 5c. When you look at the reviews of the 5C, none of them are bad reviews, they're all good. It's just that people aren't even going to try one because the 5s is out. Personally, I think that the 5C is a nice deviation from what we've been seeing with the S models. Same outer design.

    I hate plastic. But the 5c gives you a reason to actually like it.

    This time we got something different. It goes with iOS 7 and feels more sleek. It stands up among the top phones and there's nothing that can stop it. The App Store is still playing catch up to the A6.

    And now that I have one, I'm not bothered to get the 5S.
    10-28-2013 11:51 PM
  19. Auturi's Avatar
    Many places have reported the 5S is outselling the 5C at a margin of 2-to-1. Apple announced they sold 9 million iPhones release weekend. Simple extrapolation would lead us to around 3 million iPhone 5Cs release weekend.

    Also, reports estimated around 2.2 million iPhone 5C preorders. More than the iPhone 5 last year.

    Apple also announced 38 million total iPhone sales for the quarter. That means over a third of total iPhone sales for the entire fiscal quarter can be attributed to the 5S & 5C... just over the launch weekend, since 9 million alone were moved over release weekend. I'm sure many millions more were moved between then, and the end of the quarter about a week later.

    In short, many companies would kill for one of their devices to "fail" as much as the iPhone 5C. 3 million phones over a weekend is nothing to sneeze at.
    Yep, but Apple wasn't willing to say. You know the funny thing about this is just last month we all had the high-end phone and now all of a sudden things have changed. I like it when technology is able to prove itself. You know I could go out and buy a Wi-Fi ac router yeah it's technically the best technology but why would I do that? I can't use it.

    Of course I'm not going to condemn Apple for making a future proof phone, but the battery life was what I was after.

    And that's another point, what if we don't get that iPhone 6 next September. What if Apple is future proofing the iPhone 5s to keep it around for a little bit longer. Until they start making use of the A7?
    10-28-2013 11:56 PM
  20. Fausty82's Avatar
    Yet, we're getting all kinds of crazy stories. When the whole thing started, the media first said that Apple would be making a low cost version of the phone that would lose features and come with things like 3G and stuff like that.
    The "media" got it wrong. Very wrong.

    When that didn't happen, they wondered why it was so expensive. Even though the phone is actually the high quality product you expect. On top of that, there is an illusion of sales numbers between the overproduced 5c and underproduced 5s. When the 5s arrived, only 2 to 3 gold models of the phone were available at any given store.
    The 5C was never supposed to be inexpensive. Apple does things as they see fit. And judging from their financial reports, it’s working out quite well for Apple. Whether the shortage of gold 5S models was real or artificial, it has helped Apple stay in the press... and the "gold rush" continues to this day. The reports of sales ratios between the 5C and the 5S could be right. They could be wrong. Apple doesn't report to that level of granularity. That is totally their prerogative.

    I could say, well, no one cares how many it sold. These are S and C models, neither are new new iPhones.
    Both are new iPhones. These are iPhones that were not available last year. Call them incremental updates. Call them what you will... they are new iPhones. Both of them.

    What is your point in all of this?
    10-29-2013 12:12 AM
  21. Auturi's Avatar
    If what they say is right... "there isn't enough room in this town for the two of us."

    Then that means Apple's growth can't be sustained. That means they failed to create a middle tier market. Apple, and others believe they succeeded .. but others believe otherwise.

    I mean just think if it was the same thing for the MacBooks. And the iPads. What if no one bought the Airs and everyone bought the Pros? What if no one bought the mini's and everyone only bought the full size?

    Just the thought that Apple couldn't make a middle tier phone successful is disastrous. That no one was buying the 5c and everyone bought the 5s. I for one was always the type that bought middle tier and hardly ever went for the high end. Even though I was coming from a 5.

    I don't think I'd have any trouble selling the 5c when the 6 comes out as I have been told.

    Now that I have the 5c, it's a wonder why people are trying to convince me that I should get the 5s instead. Is there a real benefit?
    10-29-2013 01:10 AM
  22. Fausty82's Avatar
    If what they say is right... "there isn't enough room in this town for the two of us."

    Then that means Apple's growth can't be sustained. That means they failed to create a middle tier market. Apple, and others believe they succeeded .. but others believe otherwise.

    I mean just think if it was the same thing for the MacBooks. And the iPads. What if no one bought the Airs and everyone bought the Pros? What if no one bought the mini's and everyone only bought the full size?

    Just the thought that Apple couldn't make a middle tier phone successful is disastrous. That no one was buying the 5c and everyone bought the 5s. I for one was always the type that bought middle tier and hardly ever went for the high end. Even though I was coming from a 5.

    I don't think I'd have any trouble selling the 5c when the 6 comes out as I have been told.

    Now that I have the 5c, it's a wonder why people are trying to convince me that I should get the 5s instead. Is there a real benefit?
    If, if, if, if... none of your "if" scenarios are true. Everyone is not buying MBPs instead of MBAs. Everyone is not buying iMacs instead of Mac Minis. Everyone is not buying the iPhone 5s instead of the iPhone 5c.

    If "ifs" and "buts" were candy and nuts, every day would be Christmas. But its not. And your argument falls apart very early on. Apple never said the iPhone 5c was an inexpensive or a middle tier phone. That was the handiwork of the media and the talking heads. They got it wrong, and Apple still cleaned up.
    10-29-2013 01:57 AM
  23. Auturi's Avatar
    If, if, if, if... none of your "if" scenarios are true. Everyone is not buying MBPs instead of MBAs. Everyone is not buying iMacs instead of Mac Minis. Everyone is not buying the iPhone 5s instead of the iPhone 5c.

    If "ifs" and "buts" were candy and nuts, every day would be Christmas. But it’s not. And your argument falls apart very early on. Apple never said the iPhone 5c was an inexpensive or a middle tier phone. That was the handiwork of the media and the talking heads. They got it wrong, and Apple still cleaned up.
    Actually, ... well Apple's intention for the 5c is to be middle tier. They just said that today. It was the media that said that they were aiming the 5c for China.

    I wonder how the 5c is selling there by the way.
    10-29-2013 02:11 AM
  24. Alik Malix's Avatar
    I love these threads: Auturi, I've read all the posts on this thread - it was pure entertainment - you are/were wrong on so many points:

    1. iPhone 5S/5C difference in sales were reported by retailers and carriers (not Apple) initially and they were generally 2-1 or 3-1 with iPhone 5S outselling the 5C.
    2. Due to many pre-launch reports it was deemed that the market was already saturated, and that was the reason for a bad launch of iPhone rivals such as Galaxy S4 and HTC One, etc. After the launch - all that was proved as moot - Apple sold it's entire inventory of 5S and nearly all 5C models (there were reports that even 5C was not available at some point). Following the launch weekend, 5S were delivered by Apple as fast as they can be produced, 5C models were still selling but not as much as 5S, thus 5C was readily available when 5S was not. Recently Apple reduced the orders for 5C to direct it's production for 5S due to higher demand then expected - THAT IS AN AWESOME THING. But bottom line - 5C sold more than flagship phones of rival manufacturers.
    3. 5C was not designed to be a cheap phone but another alternative that Apple was able to sell cheaper than the 5S.
    4. 5C is a slightly improved iPhone 5: Bigger Battery, Improved Camera and Sensors, Cellular and Data for other countries, and pre-installed iOS7.
    5. It will be a long time until some Apps will not run on 5C that run on 5S and only because the App Store is much more organized, streamlined, and handpicked by Apple unlike the competition (Dont forget, Apple invented this type of 3rd Party App Store such as the ones used by competition).
    6. Lets talk about 5S: Bigger Battery, Improved Camera and Sensors, First in the world 64bit (A7) processor on a mobile with ability to easily run 32bit software. 3 or 4 times GPU upgrade (for console level gaming), Fingerprint technology with unprecedented accuracy and comfort. No iPhone before had a secondary (M7) processor, and ability to launch in so many various markets.
    7. 5S's 64bit architecture had 64bit designed games/apps for it the day it was launched - so YES, 5S is already taking advantage of the 64bit processor - You think Touch ID would work this quickly/accurately on a 32bit processor? Everything literally loads faster and smoother than the iPhone 5 (my wife's phone).
    8. And for the last time, when you buy an iPhone (any) from any Carrier or Retailer for full price - you can get it unlocked as long as it's PAID OFF IN FULL. If you're worried about carriers changing something to the iPhone - you are WRONG. Apple is the only manufacturer that does NOT let anyone tweak/change their product: Not Software, Not Hardware. You're probably thinking of Android phones with all the system level bloatware, and printed logo's on the case, and software overlays - NOT ON iPHONE, EVER!
    9. Stop saying that "no one is buying 5C" - 5C is selling better then most flagship phones of other manufacturers (compare sales figures). It's just that iPhone 5S is selling even better. And (you wanted to know), China is or was sold out of 5S just like U.S. Everyone got it wrong - it's not a saturated market, it's just not many people wanted to buy much until Apple releases their stuff.
    10. I bet Apple would have sold so, so much more if they could build them fast enough. Don't forget Apple readied 4million more iPhones for the U.S. launch than it did when they launched iPhone 5 which sold 5 million at launch, it's simple math - they ran out of phones after selling 9 million - so NO, Apple did not create a fake demand by supplying limited iPhones - it had trouble keeping up with demand regardless of the extra inventory they had ready for the launch.
    ghundiraj likes this.
    10-29-2013 05:41 AM
  25. Auturi's Avatar
    Ah, you touched on all the important points with the truth. And was right about most everything.

    This is what the articles should be talking about. It just makes a lot of sense. I wish everyone knew as much as you do.
    10-29-2013 06:59 AM
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