1. 9thWonder's Avatar
    Not exactly, Take an armed self defense course. Think about it. What is the one thing most muggers ask? "Give me your wallet." Right? My Glock is right on my hip by my wallet. Go down for wallet, come up with Glock. You have the surprise. In the days where punk gangster wannabees will kill you for tennis shoes, I'm not taking the chance this is a rob and kill. You have already presented a deadly threat, the gun or knife, and shall be responded with as such.

    There is no substitute for vigilance, but even the most vigilant person has faults. There is never any justifiably reason to say "I'm glad I have no means of defending myself. Thanks government!"
    Don't need a self defense course i'm pretty well versed in criminal law. It's a state issue so it varies by state but in the overwhelming majority there is a reasonableness component to the use of deadly force. That is the person claiming they are justified in the use of deadly force reasonably believed they or a 3rd party faced a deadly threat. In most cases an unarmed person not trying to punch you isn't going to be reasonable. It's one thing if you're presented with a weapon. It's entirely different if a mugger is unarmed or the deadly threat is over cause the person has fled and you shoot them while they flee. In fact i see you're in new york. If i remember correctly in New York you actually need to be factually correct that there is a threat of deadly force (that is murder, rape, arson etc) against you or a third person. That is it's not even enough to have a mistaken but reasonably mistaken good faith belief that you are facing a deadly threat (think knife, gun etc.) Now check the statute for sure cause i'm going on memory. But regardless if i remember correctly in New York state if some "punk" snatches your iphone on say a train and takes off running and you shoot him to stop him you're gonna go to prison for manslaughter. A punk running away? No deadly threat. Unarmed? no deadly threat. Now gun to your back? Yeah deadly threat. But that's not really at issue. But i'd suggest you not rely on some yahoo in a self defense course and speak to an accomplished criminal attorney in your state. Granted you can easily learn the law with an hour or so of googling your state statutes. good luck though. Regardless feel free to "not take the chance" but if that person is unarmed you're going to face murder charges.
    09-25-2012 05:59 AM
  2. greidel's Avatar
    I know this is an iPhone forum, but the number of people who are willing (eager, it almost sounds like) to get into a "life and death" confrontation over a replaceable electronic gadget is shocking to me. Get another one and live to enjoy another day. If you are afraid of muggers and can't afford to replace it, leave it at home or maybe you can't afford to have one in the first place.

    Use common sense, don't flash it around in strange surroundings, keep it in a secure pocket, and stay away from dark secluded spots. And don't walk around drunk looking like an easy target.
    09-25-2012 06:18 AM
  3. Darth-gamer's Avatar
    Don't need a self defense course i'm pretty well versed in criminal law. It's a state issue so it varies by state but in the overwhelming majority there is a reasonableness component to the use of deadly force. That is the person claiming they are justified in the use of deadly force reasonably believed they or a 3rd party faced a deadly threat. In most cases an unarmed person not trying to punch you isn't going to be reasonable. It's one thing if you're presented with a weapon. It's entirely different if a mugger is unarmed or the deadly threat is over cause the person has fled and you shoot them while they flee. In fact i see you're in new york. If i remember correctly in New York you actually need to be factually correct that there is a threat of deadly force (that is murder, rape, arson etc) against you or a third person. That is it's not even enough to have a mistaken but reasonably mistaken good faith belief that you are facing a deadly threat (think knife, gun etc.) Now check the statute for sure cause i'm going on memory. But regardless if i remember correctly in New York state if some "punk" snatches your iphone on say a train and takes off running and you shoot him to stop him you're gonna go to prison for manslaughter. A punk running away? No deadly threat. Unarmed? no deadly threat. Now gun to your back? Yeah deadly threat. But that's not really at issue. But i'd suggest you not rely on some yahoo in a self defense course and speak to an accomplished criminal attorney in your state. Granted you can easily learn the law with an hour or so of googling your state statutes. good luck though. Regardless feel free to "not take the chance" but if that person is unarmed you're going to face murder charges.
    I'm not quite sure you understand what a "mugging" is. Mugging, buy it's definition, is an attack on you. Not somebody coming up and asking you to take your stuff nicely, not someone running off. If you are attacked you can respond with force. In the vast majority of self defense cases involving a firearm, no shots are fired. The presence of a firearm de-escelates the situation instantly.

    I know this is an iPhone forum, but the number of people who are willing (eager, it almost sounds like) to get into a "life and death" confrontation over a replaceable electronic gadget is shocking to me. Get another one and live to enjoy another day. If you are afraid of muggers and can't afford to replace it, leave it at home or maybe you can't afford to have one in the first place.
    Ah yes, eager for confrontation. And cops are eager to shoot people as well. I mean they cary around guns too right? Fallacy. The people that went out and put their time into being a responsible concealed carry citizen never want to even draw their gun. Much in the same way people put on a seat belt never want to be in an accident. Why someone would threaten your life over an electronic gadget is shocking to me as well, but I live in the real world. I am a realist and realize that if people are getting shot for a PS3, I want to have a means to defend myself. You must realize that people don't CHOOSE to be mugged. The scum chose to put you into a life or death situation. The bit about not being able to afford it is also a fallacy given the fact that nearly every firearm mentioned here costs as much or more than an iPhone, and most us us don't have just one. My Walther P99 cost well more than one. The last bit I agree with though. Situational awareness cannot be replaced, but also cannot be solely relied on.
    jonmark likes this.
    09-25-2012 07:03 AM
  4. reeneebob's Avatar
    Not exactly, Take an armed self defense course. Think about it. What is the one thing most muggers ask? "Give me your wallet." Right? My Glock is right on my hip by my wallet. Go down for wallet, come up with Glock. You have the surprise. In the days where punk gangster wannabees will kill you for tennis shoes, I'm not taking the chance this is a rob and kill. You have already presented a deadly threat, the gun or knife, and shall be responded with as such.

    There is no substitute for vigilance, but even the most vigilant person has faults. There is never any justifiably reason to say "I'm glad I have no means of defending myself. Thanks government!"
    I like my world better than living in fear that some paranoid guy can carry a gun and is okay with killing someone in his idea of self defense over a cell phone.

    Good lord.

    Sent from mah brainzzzzz via Galaxy S III and Tapatalk 2
    scorpiodsu likes this.
    09-26-2012 12:03 AM
  5. salscott's Avatar
    I like my world better than living in fear that some paranoid guy can carry a gun and is okay with killing someone in his idea of self defense over a cell phone.

    Good lord.

    Sent from mah brainzzzzz via Galaxy S III and Tapatalk 2
    You show more contempt for someone legally protecting them self than the mugger. People who will rob you are likely to cause physical harm also. I prefer to live in a world where these low life's think twice about preying on those who are just trying to live life.
    iRy757, jonmark and mckinzie.rose like this.
    09-26-2012 08:26 AM
  6. SeanHRCC's Avatar
    and you'll simply be in prison for murdering someone over a phone. it be your word against a dead unarmed person. If they are armed then you'll likely be fine short of shooting them in the back as they leave and being caught on camera. But good luck if you kill an unarmed person. Lawyer up and be rich.
    You have no clue what you're talking about.

    For starters, you should probably look up with the definition of "murder" is, that would help you in understanding how idiotic your response sounds. The fact that you made the comment about being charged with murder removes any credibility you have with the subject.

    You should then understand the meaning of robbery (which mugging is a type of). Now within that, you have two types...robbery by intimidation and robbing by violence. Obviously we're talking about robbing by violence, if you are robbed by intimidation, you are probably not carrying a firearm in the first place.

    Afterwards, you should familiarize yourself with the protocol of using deadly force to stop someone who presents a threat to you. A person attempting to mug me would be presenting a legitimate threat of severe bodily harm or death if they actually try to take my phone (or wallet, or watch, or whatever)...If they walk up to me and ask for it, I'm going to laugh at them and keep walking, if they attempt to physically take it, they are stepping into a realm where you have no CLUE what their highest level of response will be to defense, therefore a legitimate fear of severe bodily harm or death is certainly present.

    You can call it what you want...preparedness, paranoia, etc...it is what it is. If you decide to take something that is mine by force, you COULD pay for that decision with your life.

    Now you keep making the point of shooting someone while they are running away, one situation where your argument against using deadly force stands valid, and any person who carries a firearm legally would know this. But what about the other 999,999,999 situations where the person doesn't just grab and run the other direction? What about when they reveal they have a knife? or a billy club? or decide they want to chop you in the throat? I could list other situations for days that would present a lawful situation for using deadly force...you've listed one. The ratio is a bit lop sided don't you think?

    Now please stop talking about your google understanding about law and procedure here with me, i assure you, i know more than you do about said laws and procedure.
    Last edited by SeanHRCC; 09-26-2012 at 09:14 AM.
    Fausty82 and mckinzie.rose like this.
    09-26-2012 08:40 AM
  7. reeneebob's Avatar
    You show more contempt for someone legally protecting them self than the mugger. People who will rob you are likely to cause physical harm also. I prefer to live in a world where these low life's think twice about preying on those who are just trying to live life.
    I'm so glad I don't live in the world you do. A cell phone isn't worth anyone's life. Period. 'low life' or not.

    Sent from mah brainzzzzz via Galaxy S III and Tapatalk 2
    09-26-2012 12:07 PM
  8. SeanHRCC's Avatar
    I'm so glad I don't live in the world you do. A cell phone isn't worth anyone's life. Period. 'low life' or not.

    Sent from mah brainzzzzz via Galaxy S III and Tapatalk 2
    Since when is an attack a simple act of taking a cell phone? What about the beating someone could potentially take when that robbery is happening? The stabbing? The gunshot? You pretend like (in your world) someone simply walks up to you, says "Hey sir, can you please give me your iPhone? Thank you." and that's that...no muss, no fuss.

    In the real world (where most of us live), muggers arn't Mr. Rogers and asking politely to take a phone...they're the kind of people who try to break your jaw to take your phone when you refuse to give it to them or don't response immediately like a cowering dog. Now maybe in your fantasy world (See: Canada), cowering away when someone tries to take what is yours is the way to go...happily, i don't live in that world, and I'm able to defend myself and what is mine to the level i see fit based on the threat that is presented to me.
    Fausty82 and jonmark like this.
    09-26-2012 01:14 PM
  9. salscott's Avatar
    The process to conceal/carry is vigorous, and I haven't had the time to do so yet. I have admiration and feel safer knowing there are those who take the time and effort to be proficient at protecting themselves.
    Being a criminal should come with peril.
    09-26-2012 01:21 PM
  10. ibanana's Avatar
    I actually thought about this when I purchased my phone (I am a 26 year old female). I bought it in a high end area of Cleveland where it was very busy and there were a lot of cops around the Apple store on launch day. I didn't feel threatened when I walked down to the AT&T store to change the lines around. When I was leaving AT&T and going to my car I did ask for a bag though. The bag had the box, but the phone was in my pocket. I felt safe. If anything they would have gotten a pair of headphones and a charger cable. Something I would have willingly given up if I needed to.
    09-26-2012 01:54 PM
  11. Darth-gamer's Avatar
    I like my world better than living in fear that some paranoid guy can carry a gun and is okay with killing someone in his idea of self defense over a cell phone.

    Good lord.

    Sent from mah brainzzzzz via Galaxy S III and Tapatalk 2
    When you get in your car do you put your seat belt on?

    PARANOID!

    Do you keep a fire extinguisher in your house?

    PARANOID!

    Do you wear a helmet while bike riding?

    PARANOID!

    Please. It truly is scary that someone would kill over a cell phone. Take that up with the bad guys, and I'll make sure when that fails I have a means to protect myself.
    iRy757 and mckinzie.rose like this.
    09-26-2012 05:16 PM
  12. iRy757's Avatar
    There's no theory about it bud...deadly force only requires fear of severe bodily harm or death against you, and in the case where my iPhone is in my pocket and someone decides it's their day to try and take it from me forcefully, they die.
    Agreed. If someone runs off with my belongings after taking them from me and I shoot them down and tell the officer that I was in fear for my life, that's probable cause to get off clean if your permit and gun is registered properly.
    09-26-2012 10:06 PM
  13. iRy757's Avatar
    I'm not quite sure you understand what a "mugging" is. Mugging, buy it's definition, is an attack on you. Not somebody coming up and asking you to take your stuff nicely, not someone running off. If you are attacked you can respond with force. In the vast majority of self defense cases involving a firearm, no shots are fired. The presence of a firearm de-escelates the situation instantly.


    Ah yes, eager for confrontation. And cops are eager to shoot people as well. I mean they cary around guns too right? Fallacy. The people that went out and put their time into being a responsible concealed carry citizen never want to even draw their gun. Much in the same way people put on a seat belt never want to be in an accident. Why someone would threaten your life over an electronic gadget is shocking to me as well, but I live in the real world. I am a realist and realize that if people are getting shot for a PS3, I want to have a means to defend myself. You must realize that people don't CHOOSE to be mugged. The scum chose to put you into a life or death situation. The bit about not being able to afford it is also a fallacy given the fact that nearly every firearm mentioned here costs as much or more than an iPhone, and most us us don't have just one. My Walther P99 cost well more than one. The last bit I agree with though. Situational awareness cannot be replaced, but also cannot be solely relied on.
    +1. Literally no one except my girlfriend, parents, and brother know that I conceal carry (and now you all whom I most likely will never cross paths with outside of this forum lol) It's not something I'm going to go and announce, it's not something I feel the need to show off, it doesn't boost my ego. I don't go crazy with weapons, I don't have an armory in my house, the weapon I carry is a small 9mm that holds 7 rounds, nothing to brag about, but it does what it needs to if I needed to and that's what matters. It's there because if I'm not out at work then I'm out with my family (and especially) my 6 month old son and if someone dangers their life as well as mine I wouldn't think twice about putting a slug in their chest. As stated, there are some real nut jobs out there and anyone who thinks they could never be victim of an attack needs to seriously reconsider their passive thought pattern.
    09-26-2012 10:18 PM
  14. reeneebob's Avatar
    When you get in your car do you put your seat belt on?

    PARANOID!

    Do you keep a fire extinguisher in your house?

    PARANOID!

    Do you wear a helmet while bike riding?

    PARANOID!

    Please. It truly is scary that someone would kill over a cell phone. Take that up with the bad guys, and I'll make sure when that fails I have a means to protect myself.
    1) not always

    2) no actually we don't.

    3) nope. Hate helmets.

    Sent from mah brainzzzzz via Galaxy S III and Tapatalk 2
    09-27-2012 01:05 AM
  15. reeneebob's Avatar
    Since when is an attack a simple act of taking a cell phone? What about the beating someone could potentially take when that robbery is happening? The stabbing? The gunshot? You pretend like (in your world) someone simply walks up to you, says "Hey sir, can you please give me your iPhone? Thank you." and that's that...no muss, no fuss.

    In the real world (where most of us live), muggers arn't Mr. Rogers and asking politely to take a phone...they're the kind of people who try to break your jaw to take your phone when you refuse to give it to them or don't response immediately like a cowering dog. Now maybe in your fantasy world (See: Canada), cowering away when someone tries to take what is yours is the way to go...happily, i don't live in that world, and I'm able to defend myself and what is mine to the level i see fit based on the threat that is presented to me.
    My last post in this thread because I can't agree with your ideology but I walk home at night by myself as a female without fear in a city of 30000 people.

    I guess our fantasy world in Canada is working okay since we don't have the gun violence issues you do even in areas like mine where there tend to be firearms for hunting purposes.

    I will never have a gun in my house and I'm fine with that.

    Sent from mah brainzzzzz via Galaxy S III and Tapatalk 2
    09-27-2012 01:09 AM
  16. Exxod's Avatar
    Most, if not all, muggers are willing to severely harm, or kill, their targets. Whether they want your shiny new iP5, your wallet, or your Rolex, it makes no difference. I believe a concealed weapon is a perfectly acceptable form of self-defense. And if you don't like guns, there's always mace, a taser, or a knife (my preference; just make sure you can wield it, too, learning how to throw it is alway a plus).
    09-27-2012 01:56 AM
  17. Peligro911's Avatar
    I got this covered lol muggers-imageuploadedbytapatalk1348725554.691250.jpg
    09-27-2012 01:59 AM
  18. Exxod's Avatar
    I got this covered lol Click image for larger version. 

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    That's legit.
    *iPhone powered Falcon Punch*
    iRy757 likes this.
    09-27-2012 02:02 AM
  19. Darth-gamer's Avatar
    My last post in this thread because I can't agree with your ideology but I walk home at night by myself as a female without fear in a city of 30000 people.

    I guess our fantasy world in Canada is working okay since we don't have the gun violence issues you do even in areas like mine where there tend to be firearms for hunting purposes.

    I will never have a gun in my house and I'm fine with that.

    Sent from mah brainzzzzz via Galaxy S III and Tapatalk 2
    No, you're right, no need for protection in Canada.

    Mass Shooting In Canada: Compare and Contrast | Crooks and Liars
    09-29-2012 04:29 PM
  20. Motorbones's Avatar
    Just have it surgically placed into your chest like Iron Man and then no one will dare to even try and steal it from you!!!
    09-29-2012 06:21 PM
  21. ghostface147's Avatar
    Workout. I am 210lbs at 5'8. No one even tries to mess with me.
    Until the guy who is 6'6 275 lbs decides to.

    As for me, I'm licensed to carry my sidearm....so I do.
    mckinzie.rose and miah84 like this.
    09-29-2012 06:24 PM
  22. miah84's Avatar
    Like the others this is why I have my Florida concealed weapon license and carry a M&P 45 compact. Although killing someone trying to take a cell phone is a little excessive that's a risk I'm not going to take.
    muggers-imageuploadedbytapatalk1348960183.045307.jpg


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    09-29-2012 07:10 PM
  23. SeanHRCC's Avatar
    My last post in this thread because I can't agree with your ideology but I walk home at night by myself as a female without fear in a city of 30000 people.

    I guess our fantasy world in Canada is working okay since we don't have the gun violence issues you do even in areas like mine where there tend to be firearms for hunting purposes.

    I will never have a gun in my house and I'm fine with that.

    Sent from mah brainzzzzz via Galaxy S III and Tapatalk 2
    Hmmm...

    http://www.brantfordexpositor.ca/201...ting-incidents

    ...there's a little Ontario city with some gun violence, lol. I could probably find more...but i think your stance is adorable either way. Does your little town wake up every morning and sing camp fire songs while you smile and feed each other candy?

    Enjoy your little town...i couldn't live like a child in a place where they tell me it's unlawful for citizens to own handguns. And FYI, my wife jogs in the evenings without fear in our little town of 500,000 people. She also owns a 9mm Glock, and has been named a marksman by the same instructors I qualify with for my job. She also highly disagrees with your ideology.
    Last edited by SeanHRCC; 09-29-2012 at 08:58 PM.
    09-29-2012 08:44 PM
  24. Fausty82's Avatar
    Hmmm...

    Police investigate shooting incidents | Brantford-Brant | News | Brantford Expositor

    ...there's a little Ontario city with some gun violence, lol. I could probably find more...but i think your stance is adorable either way. Does your little town wake up every morning and sing camp fire songs while you smile and feed each other candy?

    Enjoy your little town...i couldn't live like a child in a place where they tell me it's unlawful for citizens to own handguns. And FYI, my wife jogs in the evenings without fear in our little town of 500,000 people. She also owns a 9mm Glock, and has been named a marksman by the same instructors I qualify with for my job. She also highly disagrees with your ideology.
    I'm always up for a rousing rendition of kumbaya!

    muggers-jb-145-4.jpg
    09-29-2012 09:03 PM
  25. emozdashietxp's Avatar
    it is pretty scary, there has been a few crime around campus already regarding apple products. no one has been hospitalized/dead this school year, thank goodness. but i really havent given much thought to earphones :O

    i use my ipod shuffle with my outdated apple earphones not pods. im not much of a fan of listening to music with my iphone in general. but i obviously still setting myself up for an apple attractable target. im sure when i get my earphones yanked out of me only to find that i carry a shuffle isnt going to give me a free ticket since theyll probably take my money and end up finding my phone anyways LOL.

    now im going to carry an android phone (apparently no one wants to steal an android LOL) and switch out my apple earphones...to beats (lol jk) maybe some good ol' skull candy
    Attached Thumbnails muggers-imageuploadedbyimore-forums1348984424.047840.jpg  
    09-30-2012 02:00 AM
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