1. braj's Avatar
    You imply I lied previously, which is, as everyone can see, the true lie.

    I'll answer this again, but for you surfer, I will do so one last time.

    Reality (the information presented that day) was disappointing to those who predicted significantly higher numbers.
    Yep, he was comparing the 147,000 to the predicted 500-700,000. That was the context of his 'Reality sucks for fanboys' comment.
    07-26-2007 05:45 PM
  2. braj's Avatar
    Can you define 'surfer' mikec? I live in Cali so to me a surfer is a surfer (as in Dude, where's the nugs?!)
    07-26-2007 05:47 PM
  3. oalvarez's Avatar
    I was going to modify my post to use the restricting quantifier: some

    As in some Apple users...

    In hindsight I should have done that but to be honest, my comment was off-the-cuff. Though I should point out that I never used a universal quantifier in my post e.g. "all". That's how you interpreted it, and I maintain, misinterpreted. I rarely use sweeping generalization in my posts where I say "all" or "every single". You'll be hard pressed to find an example.

    Either way, one person or 100 can't disprove my assertion, which I still maintain. Why else are you involved in this thread if not to defend the iPhone? You obviously feel strongly about it as you've "left" and then returned numerous times.


    I'm not sure it's necessarily disparaging. A lot of Apple fans fly their flag quite high and proudly. I rarely see such commitment to MS or WM. Sure people prefer it, but it's not really debated.

    It was the opposite around here (TC) for a long time when WM entered the market: I had to defend WM to POS for a very long time, not out of commitment or thinking one was superior (subjective) but merely for the fact it did what I want and as predicted, it would surpass POS.

    Fact is, this is an iPhone "bashing" thread. No secret there. So I see no reason at all to apologize or ameliorate what is said here.

    I'm also not sure how I've "derided" so much as critiqued. But once again, this is the Apple victim hood coming forth.

    And if elitism of Apple and their superiority complex were not true, I fail to understand how this actually works as sarcasm and parody:

    Apple Store to Begin Charging Entrance Fee


    It's funny because there is an element of truth in it. You can't make that joke about MS (though you could make others for sure).

    you did say "apple users" which does imply anyone that uses an apple product. you did not say "some," "many" or the like. as for all of the rest it's just more spin, re-direction and games. i didn't ask for an apology and i don't think i ever would. why? because i just don't really care regardless of what you say or think.

    thanks though
    07-26-2007 05:49 PM
  4. mikec#IM's Avatar
    Can you define 'surfer' mikec? I live in Cali so to me a surfer is a surfer (as in Dude, where's the nugs?!)
    PM me.
    07-26-2007 05:50 PM
  5. oalvarez's Avatar
    I've known enough Mac users (being one myself, spending years on Macaddict's forums) to know a significant percentage of Mac users do feel like they have to stick up for Macs and are really defensive at any criticism of the platform and company whether it is warranted or not. I'm sure there are Palm loyalists, Windows loyalist, Ford Pinto loyalists and 3Com Audry loyalists and on ... that do this as well.

    But back to Apple users, there is an element of truth to it like Mal says: some people buy Macs to show that they can afford them, just like the motivation behind buying lots of other high end products. And some are insecure that they made a bad deal and need to convince themselves and others that they didn't. I know people on the opposite end of the spectrum that buy low-end and then try to justify why that piece of crap they own is better than a Ferrari. Whether it is or not is irrelevant really. It's a neurosis or something.
    they buy apple products to show that they can afford them? convince themselves that they made a bad deal? and now it's a "neurosis"!!!!!

    THAT IS ABOUT THE FUNNIEST STUFF I'VE READ YET!

    good stuff.
    07-26-2007 05:57 PM
  6. mikec#IM's Avatar
    3rd iPhone sighting in the wild.

    Funny, it's a chick with it, and all these guys are coming up to her and asking her about it, and flirting with her.
    07-26-2007 06:10 PM
  7. braj's Avatar
    they buy apple products to show that they can afford them? convince themselves that they made a bad deal? and now it's a "neurosis"!!!!!

    THAT IS ABOUT THE FUNNIEST STUFF I'VE READ YET!

    good stuff.
    Some people, I would never say that all or most Mac users do this, and I'm not saying it is limited to Mac users by a long shot. Just some people don't buy stuff because they need the features as much as the emblem on the back or on the hood etc. My wife is Chinese and I intimately know how much the concept of 'face' affects people's buying deciscions. It's really apparent in Chinese culture and not even denied in that community, but in the West we basically don't want to admit it, instead we use other justifications. But at the end of the day we want to be 'seen'. It's just the way it is.
    07-26-2007 06:11 PM
  8. braj's Avatar
    3rd iPhone sighting in the wild.

    Funny, it's a chick with it, and all these guys are coming up to her and asking her about it, and flirting with her.
    I thought it was funny that Archie and Oalvarez were saying how it would help being an 'icebreaker', basically that it just might get them laid
    07-26-2007 06:16 PM
  9. Malatesta's Avatar
    you did say "apple users" which does imply anyone that uses an apple product. you did not say "some," "many" or the like. as for all of the rest it's just more spin, re-direction and games. i didn't ask for an apology and i don't think i ever would. why? because i just don't really care regardless of what you say or think.

    thanks though
    I know what I said and I clarified in my response: some not all. You basically just re-iterated my response post. Nice job :thumbsup:

    I took the time to explain what I meant. You don't like the response, too bad.

    The rest of my post was simply contesting some of what you said, like "disparaging" that I "...have something to prove" and your use of "deride".

    That is I was actually addressing what you wrote. Trust me, I now learned my lesson: ignore anything you write since you won't actually respond.

    Here's your problem Ollie:

    - You respond to something I write, which wasn't directed towards you in the first place.
    - You challenge me on a # of points, often bringing in non-relevant topics
    - I write back either clarifying, correcting or responding back to what you actually wrote
    - You then ignore everything I wrote and accuse me of "spin", "redirection" and "games" simply because I still disagree with you (or you make an argument where none exists).

    This is what makes you terrible at this whole message board thing. There is no conversation with you, just ramblings with little coherent thought.
    07-26-2007 06:22 PM
  10. treobk214's Avatar
    As opposed to what you wrote where you personally attacked me?

    You have a problem with my posts, take it up with a Moderator.

    Otherwise, stop responding to my posts as you have no authority here. :thumbsdn:

    (Nice to see you actually avoided challenging anything I wrote. Says a lot about your case.)
    Look this is typical. You start with a flamebait post where you indirectly insult "some" apple users and now when people react you attempt to engage them into a flamewar.

    Mal, you`re not fooling anybody. You`re the one creating the problems here. Why are you feigning this indignance when it was YOU who is initiating everything? How much more disingenious can a person get?

    How obnoxious.
    07-26-2007 06:25 PM
  11. oalvarez's Avatar
    I thought it was funny that Archie and Oalvarez were saying how it would help being an 'icebreaker', basically that it just might get them laid
    Right, right......hurry and redirect while you can!
    07-26-2007 06:26 PM
  12. samkim's Avatar
    Exactly, the one who's been more right than wrong since the early 90s.
    07-26-2007 06:28 PM
  13. mikec#IM's Avatar
    Look this is typical. You start with a flamebait post where you indirectly insult "some" apple users and now when people react you attempt to engage them into a flamewar.

    Mal, you`re not fooling anybody. You`re the one creating the problems here. Why are you feigning this indignance when it was YOU who is initiating everything? How much more disingenious can a person get?

    How obnoxious.
    Really angry at the world, aren't ya?

    I suggest you go down to the ghetto part of town and start yelling the n-word. I'm sure some people would be glad to help you with your need to fight.
    07-26-2007 06:31 PM
  14. surur's Avatar
    A more on topic post - even Apple's bluetooth headset sucks.

    - Apple Bluetooth headset...came, saw, bought, returned.

    mcdj 07-24-2007 11:02 AM

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Apple Bluetooth headset...came, saw, bought, returned.

    It's a shame really because the headset, the dock and the travel cable are beyond slick.

    The sound is decent, but certainly not earth shattering, AND it only sounds good if you keep the phone on the same side of your body as the headset. Put the headset in your left ear and the phone in your right pocket and welcome to Static Town.

    More importantly, the fit is horrible, for my ears anyway. If the standard ear buds don't fit your ears, don't even bother buying this...the fit is identically bad. With 30 seconds of putting it in my ear, I fiddled with the fit 10 times, and caught it in my hand twice as it fell out while walking.

    If you're looking for a nice tiny BT headset that fits great and sounds as mediocre as the rest of the headsets on the market (except maybe for the Jawbone, which I have not/will not try due to its size), try the Samsung WEP 410...it's as small if not smaller than the Apple, equally light, and has a silicone tipped earbud a la Sennheiser CX300s.
    http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=333369

    Surur
    07-26-2007 06:32 PM
  15. mikec#IM's Avatar
    Exactly, the one who's been more right than wrong since the early 90s.
    Um...apparently not.

    As they say, she was right...until she was wrong (for three years straight).

    Even a stopped clock is correct twice a day.
    07-26-2007 06:32 PM
  16. oalvarez's Avatar
    Some people, I would never say that all or most Mac users do this, and I'm not saying it is limited to Mac users by a long shot. Just some people don't buy stuff because they need the features as much as the emblem on the back or on the hood etc. My wife is Chinese and I intimately know how much the concept of 'face' affects people's buying deciscions. It's really apparent in Chinese culture and not even denied in that community, but in the West we basically don't want to admit it, instead we use other justifications. But at the end of the day we want to be 'seen'. It's just the way it is.
    Please spare us the life lesson unless you feel the need to redirect some more.
    07-26-2007 06:33 PM
  17. Malatesta's Avatar
    Look this is typical. You start with a flamebait post where you indirectly insult "some" apple users and now when people react you attempt to engage them into a flamewar.

    Mal, you`re not fooling anybody. You`re the one creating the problems here. Why are you feigning this indignance when it was YOU who is initiating everything? How much more disingenious can a person get?

    How obnoxious.
    I start with a flamebait?

    I "started" by responding to your post, where you say things like:
    The 'doze fanboys would love to have been able to boast such a positive showing with WM smartphones on just a single carrier like this.

    They can't, hence their constant displays of apple envy
    So we have "apple envy", " 'doze fanboys" and then you accuse me of psychoanalyzing (which was sarcasm, hence my reference to Jack as in JackNaylor).

    But your post is not flamebaiting? Is it fact?

    That's where it "started", so get your facts straight. Also

    (1) How did I insult "some" Apple users?
    (2) Who cares if I did? I didn't make any ad-hominem attacks. Are Apple users above critique? Are you their defender?
    (3) Does posting something which you disagree count as flamebaiting? My we're sensitive.

    Like I said, if you have a problem with my posts take it up with a Moderator and see if they agree with you. :thumbsup: Otherwise, blow.

    I think by now, your constant responses to my posts are painting you as the stalker/flamebaiter, since you just can't let...it...go.
    07-26-2007 06:34 PM
  18. samkim's Avatar
    Um...apparently not.

    As they say, she was right...until she was wrong (for three years straight).

    Even a stopped clock is correct twice a day.
    She's been right more than she's been wrong since the early 90s. That's a pretty simple English sentence. What is it about that statement that you don't understand?
    07-26-2007 06:37 PM
  19. Malatesta's Avatar
    A more on topic post - even Apple's bluetooth headset sucks.


    http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=333369

    Surur
    I know BT is a tough-standard, but I would have pegged Apple at nailing BT.

    Guess not. Curious if they'll ever have A2DP. Is it me or does Moto have the best BT stack out there?
    07-26-2007 06:38 PM
  20. braj's Avatar
    Please spare us the life lesson unless you feel the need to redirect some more.
    You really aren't good at communication, are you? You misconstrue what I said, I explain myself (when it should have been clear the first time had you read what I said) and then use a cheap tactic to debate by simply saying I'm 'redirecting'? Whatever dude. You have no clue.
    07-26-2007 06:42 PM
  21. braj's Avatar
    A more on topic post - even Apple's bluetooth headset sucks.


    http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=333369

    Surur
    To be fair there are positive reviews there as well. I liked the comment that the OP was maybe a bit fat and that is why Bt couldn't reach when in his pocket To me $130 is too much for something you could easily lose (and that probably will be surpassed technically in 6 months anyway). I'd go for some good wired 2 in 1 headsets myself. Spend the money on the speakers instead on the BT.
    07-26-2007 06:44 PM
  22. surur's Avatar
    Ah Apple, welcome to the smartphone world. Good thing they have at least one button to reset the device.


    "Slide To Unlock" Bar Acting Weird

    HitmanX 07-23-2007 09:34 AM

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    "Slide To Unlock" Bar Acting Weird

    In the past few days I have noticed when I try to use the "Slide To Unlock" bar to access my phone or answer calls, sometimes it would have a big delay and not show the animation and sometimes not work at all! When it would not work I would press the button at the top and try again. I find this very anoying and I was wondering if anyone else was having these kind of problems? Thanks

    ecks618 07-23-2007 09:38 AM

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    I had this problem as well, a simple restart fixed everything.

    Cybergypsy 07-23-2007 09:39 AM

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Quote:

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Originally Posted by HitmanX (Post 3951549)
    In the past few days I have noticed when I try to use the "Slide To Unlock" bar to access my phone or answer calls, sometimes it would have a big delay and not show the animation and sometimes not work at all! When it would not work I would press the button at the top and try again. I find this very anoying and I was wondering if anyone else was having these kind of problems? Thanks
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------


    once or twice, but have it in the car hooked to mt bluetooth so really never touch it....

    havok5178 07-23-2007 01:17 PM

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    Turn Power Off

    I've been using my iPhone for about a week now and I've noticed quite a few bugs. Although I wouldn't really call most of them bugs. My opinion is that since you never really close a program, you just "minimize" it, for lack of a better term, eventually you bog the system down.

    I've read anecdotes of people complaining that they were watching Lost and talking on the phone and had 5 web pages open, and couldn't figure out why it became unresponsive.

    I had this slider problem too, and my best advice is to power down the iPhone every couple of days and restart it, much like you'd do with your home computer. From what I've read, and from personal experience, this seems to solve 99% of the problems. It would also help to remember that while this is an amazing phone/ipod, it is not a full fledged computer and thus, does have limitations. Remembering that will stave off loads of frustration.

    S.

    rriggs 07-23-2007 01:19 PM

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    hmmm i've been having this problem as well....

    iBookG4user 07-23-2007 01:20 PM

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    I had this problem also, a restore fixed it.

    HitmanX 07-23-2007 02:21 PM

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    ya a simple power down and power back up fixed the problem. But its still anoying when you are not able to answer a phone call

    iBookG4user 07-23-2007 02:30 PM

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Quote:

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Originally Posted by HitmanX (Post 3952695)
    ya a simple power down and power back up fixed the problem. But its still anoying when you are not able to answer a phone call
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------


    I found that when I was at the unlock screen and it was being unresponsive like that, I would slide my finger across the slider and hit the home button. That would usually work to get it to the next screen.

    lonnielove 07-23-2007 06:08 PM

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Quote:

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Originally Posted by havok5178 (Post 3952417)
    I've been using my iPhone for about a week now and I've noticed quite a few bugs. Although I wouldn't really call most of them bugs. My opinion is that since you never really close a program, you just "minimize" it, for lack of a better term, eventually you bog the system down.

    I've read anecdotes of people complaining that they were watching Lost and talking on the phone and had 5 web pages open, and couldn't figure out why it became unresponsive.

    I had this slider problem too, and my best advice is to power down the iPhone every couple of days and restart it, much like you'd do with your home computer. From what I've read, and from personal experience, this seems to solve 99% of the problems. It would also help to remember that while this is an amazing phone/ipod, it is not a full fledged computer and thus, does have limitations. Remembering that will stave off loads of frustration.

    S.
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------


    i agree with that i think alot of people want it to do what a MAC or PC does. i think all we need now is i a cd burner built in. haha LOL.

    slffl 07-23-2007 06:18 PM

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    I've had this too. I think it's either the memory being full or the CPU is being used by something else (maybe web pages in Safari). A reboot fixed it though.

    rriggs 07-24-2007 03:35 PM

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Quote:

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Originally Posted by slffl (Post 3953669)
    I've had this too. I think it's either the memory being full or the CPU is being used by something else (maybe web pages in Safari). A reboot fixed it though.
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------



    yes, i'm thinking there is something that randomly gets hung up and eats the CPU causing one of those days where the battery is empty before leaving work!

    millerrh 07-24-2007 05:30 PM

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    I had a similar problem. Someone called me, I went to "slide to answer" and nothing happened. The whole thing just was unresponsive and I had to restart it to get it to work.

    jecapaga 07-24-2007 06:01 PM

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Even more annoying when you set your phone for your alarm in the morning and the onscreen snooze button is not responsive at all and the alarm won't stop. So then I tried to swipe the phone to get the alarm to shut off and the slide bar didn't move.


    Quote:

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Originally Posted by HitmanX (Post 3952695)
    ya a simple power down and power back up fixed the problem. But its still anoying when you are not able to answer a phone call
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------



    HitmanX 07-24-2007 10:18 PM

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Seems like a pretty common problem. I hope apple tweaks the bar in the 1.1 firmware update. There must be a way to some how refresh the cache or something, for that particular thing. Then again I could be talking out of my ***, lol. Come on :apple: this is an important bug fix!

    tooshaggy 07-24-2007 10:24 PM

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    mine gets funky sometimes. I just turn it off, and then back on. seems to fix it.

    sbrownla 07-24-2007 10:48 PM

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    funny...

    It's a phone that runs applications, so you have to expect that the ram is going to get clogged.

    The Phone application itself is usually the most resource intensive program that any smartphone runs.

    Welcome to the SmartPhone world.

    Windows Mobiles do it, Symbians do it, and so do iPhones.


    kilana 07-25-2007 05:40 PM

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    Turn iPhone On...then Off...

    While this process works well, it can become quite annoying. But then again, it only takes a few seconds to "reboot" every few days, maybe even weeks for some. I can live with that....but I do hope Apple can come up with a fix for this, as well as other bugs....SOON.

    fozo 07-25-2007 07:26 PM

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    I have the same issue. Also rebooted but still didn't make this go away. Any other suggestion?

    Kurt Hustle 07-26-2007 03:34 PM

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Quote:

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    I found that when I was at the unlock screen and it was being unresponsive like that, I would slide my finger across the slider and hit the home button. That would usually work to get it to the next screen.
    __________________
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------


    My iPhone just started doing this today. Slider is unresponsive when unlocking and when i powered down. I also have been hitting home key to work around it. A restart seemed to fix it for now..hope it doesnt happen again
    http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=332893

    Surur
    07-26-2007 06:47 PM
  23. surur's Avatar
    Is it my imagination, or are these problems getting worse as the device ages? Last week it was just apps crashing, now the whole device is locking up. At least a soft reset always fixes it...

    http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=333839

    - iphone totally frozen

    n00basaur 07-25-2007 02:10 PM

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    iphone totally frozen

    Well, I was loading a page in safari and then EVERYTHING stoped working. I can't shut it off, battery won't say if it's charging or not, volume keys don't work. I've tried syncing it to try a restore but it won't even sync either. I've also tried holding the home button for a few seconds to force quit safari but no luck.

    What should I do?

    yoman 07-25-2007 02:18 PM

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Quote:

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Originally Posted by n00basaur (Post 3961113)
    Well, I was loading a page in safari and then EVERYTHING stoped working. I can't shut it off, battery won't say if it's charging or not, volume keys don't work. I've tried syncing it to try a restore but it won't even sync either. I've also tried holding the home button for a few seconds to force quit safari but no luck.

    What should I do?
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------


    You may have already done this but have you done a soft reset on it yet.

    You do this by holding the sleep/wake button down while pressing the home button until you see the apple symbol in the middle of the screen.

    n00basaur 07-25-2007 03:29 PM

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Thanks a bunch that worked!

    Giies 07-26-2007 02:55 PM

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    My iPhone just got frozen this morning too while I was brownsing through the music. And then it jump back to the home screen and all 4 button at the bottom disappeared like it's nothing there and it froze , wouldn't let me do anything except turning it off, and it work fine when i turn it back on.
    http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=333839

    Surur
    07-26-2007 06:55 PM
  24. surur's Avatar
    But sometimes soft-resets dont seem to work at all...

    - iPhone Stuck On Reboot Apple Logo Screen

    PeterB10128 07-26-2007 01:10 PM

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    iPhone Stuck On Reboot Apple Logo Screen

    No matter how many times I try to reset the phone by pressing the power button and home key, it just goes black for a few moments and then back to the Apple logo reboot screen - and it doesn't advance from there.

    Any advice on how to fix this problem?

    I can't be the only person to have encountered this problem...

    iBookG4user 07-26-2007 01:12 PM

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    Have you tried pushing and holding the power and home buttons for 25 seconds?

    PeterB10128 07-26-2007 01:18 PM

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    Yes, I've tried holding both for 25 seconds and I still can't get past the Apple logo screen.

    TimHartattack 07-26-2007 01:24 PM

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    Can you connect to iTunes and do a full restore? Does that fix it?

    PeterB10128 07-26-2007 01:31 PM

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    No, iTunes doesn't recognize the iPhone.

    mercury6966 07-26-2007 04:29 PM

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    hey i have almost the same problem, except i get the "Please connect to itunes" which means my iphone is in restore mode for some wierd reason. It was working this morning and then i go to use my phone and there you have that message. believe it or not this is my 2nd iphone i had the same issues with my 1st iphone plus the wifi would not work. they exchanged it for me and then i had the wifi issue again right after I got that "Please connect to itunes" thing again and it forced me to restore and now for the 2nd time since i got my new iphone I got that message again. this is really annoying, i'm going to see those geniuses at the apple store i'm not doing a restore so that they can see how crappy this phone has become. I'm so done that i'm thinking of just asking for my money back.
    http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=334220

    Surur
    07-26-2007 07:00 PM
  25. mikec#IM's Avatar
    She's been right more than she's been wrong since the early 90s. That's a pretty simple English sentence. What is it about that statement that you don't understand?
    I think you need to provide a little evidence if you want to state something as fact, rather than your opinion.

    Here are the past eight years:

    http://www.cxoadvisory.com/gurus/Cohen/

    You offered her as an analyst who is right most of the time. Obviously, this is not true, although she may be "more right" (but still wrong) than her peers.
    07-26-2007 07:01 PM
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