1. oalvarez's Avatar
    given that it's more than obvious that some have made it their will to diffuse the upcoming iPhone, i thought that it would be fun to hear from some of the Treo and iPhone crowd who are less than enamored with what Palm has done with the Treo for some years now.

    go ahead, after all, this is TreoCentral, and this is the Other Devices/Apple iPhone board.
    06-27-2007 11:10 PM
  2. MacUser's Avatar
    I guess I was hoping they would come out with something new...or at least newer.
    06-27-2007 11:14 PM
  3. oalvarez's Avatar
    whom? Palm or Apple?
    06-27-2007 11:22 PM
  4. MacUser's Avatar
    whom? Palm or Apple?
    Palm...my bad.
    06-27-2007 11:23 PM
  5. oalvarez's Avatar
    thought so. regards
    06-27-2007 11:25 PM
  6. bruckwine's Avatar
    It's all on the treo-specific boards..is this an attempt to rehash what is already posted (much less waste storage space)?

    There are plenty complaints about Palm... isn't this what the Treo threads are for? The creation of THIS subforum was so ppl could do the same (praise, bash and critique) THIS device...or so I thought!

    So..is this the right forum?
    06-27-2007 11:31 PM
  7. Pearl_Diva's Avatar
    No true updates, just small increments of what they should have put on the last phone. No new OS. No new anything(internally anyway), LOL!

    Even RIM had sense enough to revamp things so people actually notice!
    06-27-2007 11:32 PM
  8. Certs's Avatar
    It's all on the treo-specific boards..is this an attempt to rehash what is already posted (much less waste storage space)?

    There are plenty complaints about Palm... isn't this what the Treo threads are for? The creation of THIS subforum was so ppl could do the same (praise, bash and critique) THIS device...or so I thought!

    So..is this the right forum?
    Thank you, couldn't say it better.
    06-28-2007 12:02 AM
  9. oalvarez's Avatar
    and how many threads have we read re-hashing the same, stupid comments regarding the iPhone?

    in the "Treo" forums no one wants to hear about their Treo misgivings.

    i believe i opened it up to all parties.

    it's a two way street my friends.
    06-28-2007 12:13 AM
  10. Dim-Ize's Avatar
    I like the Treo. I would like to have some other features which it lacks. Every single device on the market has some feature which is missing to make it the perfect phone for some other person. Each person is unique in the specific combination of design appeal and feature set.

    For for my needs, the Treo meets more of my requirements than any other handheld that is currently on the market, including the iPhone which comes out in 2 days. So, I am using the best device for myself at present.

    I'm looking forward to the day when "MyPhone" is available. Where I can go down a list on my PC screen and pick and choose exactly what options I want - like you do when purchasing a PC. Customizing the amount of memory, network of my choice, Wi-Fi, GPS, form factor (keypad, touchscreen, slider, one-handed), etc. The whole thing is so silly since the carriers get to decide what we get. It's a shame really. I wish it were consumer driven instead of carrier driven so we could get out of the contract business and force the carriers to compete soley on price / coverage and force the handheld manufacturers to be innovative and compete on price / customization.
    06-28-2007 02:02 AM
  11. Malatesta's Avatar
    Palm Treo 700wx: Best WM5 device available in the U.S./CDMA market. :thumbsup:

    Look forward to the 800 WM series as I'm not impressed with the Mogul or CDMA Touch.

    Palm Linux might be interesting...at least it'll be easy to develop for.

    AT&T/Verizon/T-mobile can blow.
    06-28-2007 02:19 AM
  12. tirk's Avatar
    I'm delighted with my 680. It's stable, does the PIM basics really well (my desktop calendar is replicated onto 3 PCs without the use of Outlook or Exchange, which I consider a positive), it's works as a phone, with Chatter I have brilliant push email from multiple accounts, plays my music (including OGG files), and video adequately...

    The best Palm device I've ever owned.

    Are their their things I'd like improved or added? Certainly, but the 680 is the best compromise available for my needs.
    06-28-2007 05:11 AM
  13. bruckwine's Avatar
    and how many threads have we read re-hashing the same, stupid comments regarding the iPhone?

    in the "Treo" forums no one wants to hear about their Treo misgivings.

    i believe i opened it up to all parties.

    it's a two way street my friends.
    Er..no it isn't. There are no iPhone threads in the treo 680 or treo 650 subforums - it's called moderation. Threads here will end up rehashing the iPhone because this IS the iPhone thread - where else do you want us to talk about it? What else do you want us to talk about in here? The problems with the PS3 or XBOX 360? :crazy:

    But..if you want to have a dig at Palm (or anyone else you think in the whole wide world who doesn't improve their products well - say microsoft, linux, kyocera) by pretending this new thread has anything to do with the iPhone then fell free. It's up to the mods I guess, but we might as well start another thread about microsoft and wm6 while we're at it...

    I won't defend Palm on the problems and faults they have, but I do know I love my treo 680...as others I hope they improve too.
    06-28-2007 06:31 AM
  14. ktm97's Avatar
    I would love to get an iphone....but if the phone craps out what do you do,
    with my 680 I can take out the sim and put it into a different device, freezes i can do a reset, battery dies i can put in a new one.
    06-28-2007 09:41 AM
  15. dstrauss#IM's Avatar
    My thought keeps turning to form factor. The iPhone has more "high power draw" features than any Treo; same goes for the Blackjack (in fact, the Euro version of the Blackjack adds WiFi to HSDPA, quadband GSM, and bluetooth) and on specs they far exceed battery power of the bigger Treo. Even the high capacity battery version of the Blackjack leaves you with a device half the thickness of a Treo.

    I'm tired of the apologists for Palm. There is just no excuse for their lack of innovation in face of the WM5-WM6 devices out there, and now the iPhone. No single device has gotten it 100% right yet, but many are in the 90% category. Palm is lagging back in the 80's (%, although that could be decade). No Palm OS HSDPA device; no WiFi devices at all; double thick and half the features.

    Many around here think I'm just a Palm basher like Surur takes down iPhone, and that couldn't be further from the truth. I started with an original Palm Pilot eons ago, but in effect, save for color, Palm hasn't advanced the ball much past OS 4. I know the folks who inspired the original could/should/are capable of great things that would put the current crop of converged devices out to pasture. However, they come up with Foleo and head the wrong direction. It's just frustration, pure and simple.
    06-28-2007 10:25 AM
  16. mikec#IM's Avatar
    My thought keeps turning to form factor. The iPhone has more "high power draw" features than any Treo; same goes for the Blackjack (in fact, the Euro version of the Blackjack adds WiFi to HSDPA, quadband GSM, and bluetooth) and on specs they far exceed battery power of the bigger Treo. Even the high capacity battery version of the Blackjack leaves you with a device half the thickness of a Treo.

    I'm tired of the apologists for Palm. There is just no excuse for their lack of innovation in face of the WM5-WM6 devices out there, and now the iPhone. No single device has gotten it 100% right yet, but many are in the 90% category. Palm is lagging back in the 80's (%, although that could be decade). No Palm OS HSDPA device; no WiFi devices at all; double thick and half the features.

    Many around here think I'm just a Palm basher like Surur takes down iPhone, and that couldn't be further from the truth. I started with an original Palm Pilot eons ago, but in effect, save for color, Palm hasn't advanced the ball much past OS 4. I know the folks who inspired the original could/should/are capable of great things that would put the current crop of converged devices out to pasture. However, they come up with Foleo and head the wrong direction. It's just frustration, pure and simple.
    It's not bashing, it's just true.

    Palm had the market cornered, and proceeded to blow it. I don't think there has ever been such an inept management team in the history of technology. It is weren't for the Treo, they would be dead.

    I am frustrated too...but what do you do? Watch the slow death.

    Blackjack with a WM6 and touchscreen and it's over.
    06-28-2007 10:30 AM
  17. UnclePunk's Avatar
    The iPhone is exactly what the cell phone industry needed... a good swift kick in the ***. Let's be real. The 700P that I carry around with me is too heavy, too bulky, can't multitask, hasn't had an OS revision in how long? This thing is Reagan-era technology. They *finally* got rid of the stupid external antenna with the 755p, but I've sworn to myself that I wouldn't ever get another Palm OS device. Why? The Palm OS has become horrendously outdated. Where is the innovation happening? RIM & Apple.

    Palm had the opportunity to pull ahead, way ahead of the competition but instead sat down and did virtually nothing. The 700P that I carry around with me is essentially identical to the 650 that I used to have... just that i now have EVDO, a little more internal memory, and a slightly better camera. Sometimes I wonder whether Palm resists upgrading the internal memory on their devices just so they can use that as a "feature"... to try and tempt people to upgrade to a newer Treo where more memory is one of the only new features.

    RIM keeps refining their technology, now making themselves a viable application platform. They've recently announced that their Blackberry software will be virtualizable, thus expanding their market beyond devices that they themselves directly sell. Granted, at this point it's vaporware, but is a cool option. Imagine virtualized blackberry software on an iPhone. The iPhone would instantly become a corporate device! With devices like the Pearl and the Curve, you can see that they're innovating... or at least to the point of you actually seeing a difference from model to model.

    Apple hasn't always gotten things right, but they have more often than not. The Newton was ahead of it's time. Hell, before Steve Jobs came to Apple and was with NeXT, the NeXT computer at one point was about 10 years ahead of it's time! Unfortunately it was way too expensive. When Steve came back to Apple he pretty much single handedly resurrected the company.

    The iPhone's features are *AMAZING*. In my opinion, phone technology has crawled along for too long. Look at what's currently on sale in Japan and South Korea. Isn't it nice to finally hold up a piece of technology that would make them jealous? The cell phone industry hasn't put enough time into truly innovating. They would release phones that either match other offerings or just barely have more features than the competition.

    The main problem with the iPhone is the network. AT&T, I'm still amazed that they decided to rename Cingular and bring back a "broken brand." Everyone still remembers how terrible AT&T phone service was. EDGE for data is horrendous.
    06-28-2007 10:45 AM
  18. mikec#IM's Avatar
    The iPhone is exactly what the cell phone industry needed... a good swift kick in the ***. Let's be real. The 700P that I carry around with me is too heavy, too bulky, can't multitask, hasn't had an OS revision in how long? This thing is Reagan-era technology. They *finally* got rid of the stupid external antenna with the 755p, but I've sworn to myself that I wouldn't ever get another Palm OS device. Why? The Palm OS has become horrendously outdated. Where is the innovation happening? RIM & Apple.

    Palm had the opportunity to pull ahead, way ahead of the competition but instead sat down and did virtually nothing. The 700P that I carry around with me is essentially identical to the 650 that I used to have... just that i now have EVDO, a little more internal memory, and a slightly better camera. Sometimes I wonder whether Palm resists upgrading the internal memory on their devices just so they can use that as a "feature"... to try and tempt people to upgrade to a newer Treo where more memory is one of the only new features.

    RIM keeps refining their technology, now making themselves a viable application platform. They've recently announced that their Blackberry software will be virtualizable, thus expanding their market beyond devices that they themselves directly sell. Granted, at this point it's vaporware, but is a cool option. Imagine virtualized blackberry software on an iPhone. The iPhone would instantly become a corporate device! With devices like the Pearl and the Curve, you can see that they're innovating... or at least to the point of you actually seeing a difference from model to model.

    Apple hasn't always gotten things right, but they have more often than not. The Newton was ahead of it's time. Hell, before Steve Jobs came to Apple and was with NeXT, the NeXT computer at one point was about 10 years ahead of it's time! Unfortunately it was way too expensive. When Steve came back to Apple he pretty much single handedly resurrected the company.

    The iPhone's features are *AMAZING*. In my opinion, phone technology has crawled along for too long. Look at what's currently on sale in Japan and South Korea. Isn't it nice to finally hold up a piece of technology that would make them jealous? The cell phone industry hasn't put enough time into truly innovating. They would release phones that either match other offerings or just barely have more features than the competition.

    The main problem with the iPhone is the network. AT&T, I'm still amazed that they decided to rename Cingular and bring back a "broken brand." Everyone still remembers how terrible AT&T phone service was. EDGE for data is horrendous.
    I don't think anyone disagrees that the phone industry needed a kick in the arse, and that they are happy to see the competition.

    They may debate feature, function, and value, but I think everyone is glad to see it (even if sick of the hype).
    06-28-2007 10:58 AM
  19. surur's Avatar
    The iPhone's features are *AMAZING*. In my opinion, phone technology has crawled along for too long. Look at what's currently on sale in Japan and South Korea. Isn't it nice to finally hold up a piece of technology that would make them jealous? The cell phone industry hasn't put enough time into truly innovating. They would release phones that either match other offerings or just barely have more features than the competition.
    Really? What features are those?

    Surur
    06-28-2007 11:03 AM
  20. dstrauss#IM's Avatar
    It's not bashing, it's just true.

    Palm had the market cornered, and proceeded to blow it. I don't think there has ever been such an inept management team in the history of technology. It is weren't for the Treo, they would be dead.

    I am frustrated too...but what do you do? Watch the slow death.

    Blackjack with a WM6 and touchscreen and it's over.
    Oh man, a Blackjack, WM6 and touch screen would be awesome; although I have to admit I've really gotten used to Smartphone without a touch screen thanks to Samsung's additions to the interface. I'd have to say the last fiasco's as bad as this were Adam Osborne's pre-announcment of the II (killed the company) and Wordperfect's botching an incredible lead in word processing by refusing to move to Windows quickly.

    "Slow death" for Palm may not be as slow as some think...maybe they've got some secret weapon up their sleeve, but I strongly doubt it. I don't think they could even match the first generation Blackjack in a year's time at this rate.

    Like you, I'm sick of the iPhone hype too...but if it builds a fire under the industry to move past "me too" devices, it is worth it.
    06-28-2007 11:04 AM
  21. bruckwine's Avatar
    I think everyone is happy that other companies see Apple as a threat (rather than laugh them off - the iPod history has made sure of that). We all want to see further innovation. That said it doesn't mean any device including said iPhone has reached where we want it to go (it could've imo but they left out a lot they thought wassn't necessary etc), hence why A LOT of ppl including those supposedly "bashing" the iPhone are eagerly awaiting v2.0 and so on i.e. future phones.

    Now that the ante is upped let's see in the next year or two who comes out on top. And let's hope they don't come out with good technology that is tied down to bad options (here I refer to AT&T's iPhone monopoly lock on a GSm phone for 5 yrs)!
    06-28-2007 11:14 AM
  22. dstrauss#IM's Avatar
    I think everyone is happy that other companies see Apple as a threat (rather than laugh them off - the iPod history has made sure of that). We all want to see further innovation. That said it doesn't mean any device including said iPhone has reached where we want it to go (it could've imo but they left out a lot they thought wassn't necessary etc), hence why A LOT of ppl including those supposedly "bashing" the iPhone are eagerly awaiting v2.0 and so on i.e. future phones.

    Now that the ante is upped let's see in the next year or two who comes out on top. And let's hope they don't come out with good technology that is tied down to bad options (here I refer to AT&T's iPhone monopoly lock on a GSm phone for 5 yrs)!
    Good points all, particularly the highlighted passage above. Hubris gets many companies and Apple is far from immune (ie - you don't really need a two button mouse - geez). Like you, I'm amazed at the long term tie-in with AT&T, but maybe that's only for GSM versions (we can only hope)? It could also be a sad reflection of the fact that Verizon and Sprint are so controlling they can't even envision releasing any control to handset manuafacturers? Look at the phenomenal Samsung i550; the POS 5 device that could have ruled the converged universe BEFORE Treo; and Sprint killed it because it didn't fit their perceived needs. Then look at the GSM world - HTC releases WM5 adavanced phone overseas, and customer clamor forces Cingualr and T-Mobile to get in line because idiots like me spend a fortune importing and unlocking Q8500 and other WM5 devices and switching SIMS. At least we get a choice that way.
    06-28-2007 11:33 AM
  23. Malatesta's Avatar
    Motorola, Verizon...just about everyone has said the iPhone is great for the industry.

    Only 1 of 4 carriers has the iphone, the other 3 need something. For once they might allow more experimentation and risk taking on design and functionality. Till now, the carriers have been quite conservative in what they'll take. If you actually talk to these companies, they'll tell you that carriers are the #1 impediment to new technology/form factors, etc b/c they don't like risk.

    Plus now people will expect more from "smartphones" and see them as a consumer, not just a business device. I can't wait to see what happens in the next 12 months. No one will match the iPhone, but it'll drive innovation elsewhere.
    06-28-2007 11:46 AM
  24. UnclePunk's Avatar
    Link re: virtualized Blackberry software (Blackberry Application Suite), in case anyone asks. Thing is supposed to be fundamentally different than Blackberry Connect, which as everyone knows was vaporware for the longest time and never really turned into much when it finally came out:

    http://rim.com/news/press/2007/pr-23_04_2007-01.shtml

    At this point they're aiming at Windows Mobile 6, but can you imagine if they got this thing running on the iPhone what a boost that would give to it as a corporate device? Again, the crippling factor of the iPhone is the AT&T network. I know Apple was in talks with other carriers... unfortunately Apple wanted too much control, way more than Sprint or Verizon were willing to give up.
    06-28-2007 11:52 AM
  25. syphex#IM's Avatar
    Really? What features are those?

    Surur
    Thats what im saying!! what features does the iphone have that the treo doesn't? You haven't personally used this phone you don't really know how crappy its going to be. That commercial they have showing You Tube is a joke... are you kidding me??? You Tube over EDGE?? no way in hell it would ever be that smooth and watchable.... There are no great features of the iphone over a treo. I can't wait to see how disapointed people are at this phone after they use it a while. No innovation at all.. the iphone doesn't have one thing NEW on it that some other phone doesn't already have... and btw treo users already have the ability to watch you tube.. and its not that great.
    06-28-2007 01:36 PM
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