1. mikec#IM's Avatar
    Archie,

    A pro (minus con) list is fine, but don't post it as if no other phone has this stuff. It's false.
    06-28-2007 04:33 PM
  2. mikec#IM's Avatar
    What are you talking about? You just randomly picked those out.



    I am giving you a chance to tell me why they are wrong.
    For starters, it's not the thinnest.

    Nor is Internet content controlled by the carrier (not sure where that came from).
    06-28-2007 04:35 PM
  3. Malatesta's Avatar
    You know, alot of these things you harp on and continually bring up and just burn into the gound, over and over, like there is no stopping because you can't let it go...
    Listen, I'm just making some observations and trying to understand the limitations of the device.

    I don't use GSM, nor do I travel abroad often so this is a non-issue for me. However, one argument that people constantly bring up about the benefit of GSM is what I mentioned about using pre-paid SIM cards.

    I understand the nature of the device makes it rely on Apple servers for functionality (at least some) and that AT&T wants that device as exclusive. Fine, that is understandable.

    But it is relevant and still a limit on the device. I have not taken the position that any of these omission will limit sales, cause negative reviews or make it a terrible device. It does not mean though we cannot discuss what are some interesting limitations on a device that proclaims to be so advanced from everything we use today. In some areas, yes, others no.
    06-28-2007 04:39 PM
  4. sxtg's Avatar
    So it boils down to roughly 30 something different ways that it looks cool?

    Could be less as I dont have time to point them out, but glancing through your list I noticed a few that were the same "feature" just a different implementation.



    Here's my list of positives that no other phone has which is justification for me in sacrificing a couple of features.


    1. It's Mac friendly.
    2. Revolutionary touch interface
    3. Two-finger stretching gesture
    4. Two-finger tap-to-zoom out gesture
    5. Two-finger pinching gesture
    6. One-finger double-tap-to-zoom in gesture
    7. One-finger scrolling gesture
    8. One-finger flicking gesture
    9. One-finger swiping/sweeping (depends on the context) gesture
    10. One button design - that lone button on the bottom of the phone will take you back to the home screen, provide quick accessibility to the iPhone's list of applications, provide a quick escape from the depths of any application or settings screen and act as a clean up/clean start tool - all with one quick press.
    11. Large 3.5 inch screen. Biggest camera view screen ever made.
    12. Thinnest phone available anywhere.
    13. High resolution screen provides 160 pixels per inch
    14. The most readable text (fonts) of any handheld device ever made.
    15. Largest dialing keypad available on any mobile phone for easy number entry
    16. The stability and reliability and security that comes with OS X and LLVM.
    17. That incredible scrolling with rubber band effects mirroring real physics effects
    18. THE BEST mobile browsing experience... period.
    19. Easiest conference call management I have ever seen.
    20. A true web applications platform for a mobile phone. With Safari, now apps can be developed for any desktop computer and the iPhone.
    21. Internet content is not determined by the carrier (who wants to sell the user something), as is the case with every other phone that can utilize the internet.
    22. Coolest implementation of Google Maps I have ever seen.
    23. Access to YouTube videos with no extra charge. This is unlike other offerings where carries have mobile video plans that use the walled garden approach: accessible only with a monthly charge and giving only short clips.
    24. Widgets and applications that provide quick, good-looking and easy to use net based services.
    25. Push-IMAP support like a Blackberry, not that fake pushing either.
    26. Continual surveying of wi-fi availability with automatic switching. Previously joined networks are quietly and seamless connected to.
    27. Appropriate and usable visual cues within the slickest user interface I have ever seen.
    28. It doesn't have carrier logos plastered all over it.
    29. It uses a quad-band GSM radio which allows it to be used in every country except Japan.
    30. Context sensitive keyboard that pops up when needed. This is extremely useful and really well done.
    31. Bizarre and unheard of concepts like "touching your music" and "Visual Voicemail" (random access) actually make sense in using the iPhone.
    32. Voice mail scrubbing. Lets you scrub through the voice mail timeline to quickly get to where you want.
    33. Voice mail is sent to you - like push e-mail. You can listen to and review your voice mail on a train or on a plane, without the need of carrier reception.
    34. Coverflow browsing of music and media. Plus, you can flick an album and it spins around to reveal the song list to choose from on the back... just like physical albums.
    35. The iPhone screen faade can actually be quickly and simply wiped clean with its unique edgeless, no-bezel design. This is to say nothing of the specially selected screen material chosen for use with grimy, greasy fingers.
    36. An external speaker (for speakerphone functionality AND iPod use) that doesn't get covered up when you lay it down like every other phone on the market. Thank you.
    37. iPhone's antenna is located in the back part of the phone at the very bottom. Very considerate for those with radiation concerns. Never understood why manufacturers continue placing the antenna as close to your head as possible.
    38. Fully charged battery will provide up to 6 hours of internet use, 7 hours of video playback, 8 hours of talk time, 24 hours of audio playback, 250 hours of standby time This is unbelievable performance.
    39. Context sensitive, smoothly transforming control surfaces provide an intuitive user interface.
    40. Big bubble editing lets you touch and hold the screen to get a zoomed in area of text for precise cursor placement with your finger.
    41. The keyboard - I know a little bit about what they are doing to make this unique keyboard a success. Every little space on that screen is tracking and measuring and relating to every other little space. There is a great deal of processing power required JUST for the simple act of typing. And reading how your finger hits the screen and what part of your finger hits first and the total amount of space that it hits all in an effort to account for inaccuracies. There is a lot of research that has been done here. They even take into account a person's inability to accurately predict what part of their finger actually hits the screen. It seems that we fail to take into account the curve of our finger and how it actually hits the screen based on the overhead view we have in watching the screen as we type. Then of course there is the software based auto-correcting type of feature that analyzes which keys you MIGHT have meant to hit and figures out the word you wanted. And then of course word prediction. To this end, word prediction itself is also used in conjunction with a process of dynamically enlarging tap zones behind the scenes for virtually larger keys.
    06-28-2007 04:43 PM
  5. archie's Avatar
    For starters, it's not the thinnest.

    Nor is Internet content controlled by the carrier (not sure where that came from).
    I want to know which phone is thinner.

    In regards to carrier controlled, are you forgetting things like Sprint PCS and Verizons data service? What about Vodaphone?

    And then there is the issue of mobile web page squishing by these carriers and more.
    06-28-2007 04:45 PM
  6. bruckwine's Avatar
    Here's my list of positives that no other phone has which is justification for me in sacrificing a couple of features.


    1. It's Mac friendly (??? not sure if you mean it shares it's lunch with macs, but , well mac DID make it...treos are mac & Windows friendly)
    2. Revolutionary touch interface
    3. Two-finger stretching gesture
    4. Two-finger tap-to-zoom out gesture
    5. Two-finger pinching gesture
    6. One-finger double-tap-to-zoom in gesture
    7. One-finger scrolling gesture
    8. One-finger flicking gesture
    9. One-finger swiping/sweeping (depends on the context) gesture

    (I THINK 2-9 are actually one feature just so you know but if that's your bag, check)

    10. One button design - that lone button on the bottom of the phone will take you back to the home screen, provide quick accessibility to the iPhone's list of applications, provide a quick escape from the depths of any application or settings screen and act as a clean up/clean start tool - all with one quick press.
    (sounds like the treo home button to me, but then it lacks the otehr buttons that carry you straight to the major PHONE function and mail function etc)

    11. Large 3.5 inch screen. Biggest camera view screen ever made (check on large..but i think you meant biggest cameraphone vs ever made?!)
    12. Thinnest phone available anywhere. (for now, check)
    13. High resolution screen provides 160 pixels per inch
    14. The most readable text (fonts) of any handheld device ever made.
    ( ROTFLMAO..and how do you know this? In case you don't know tablet PCs are handhelds too and so are ebook Readers)
    15. Largest dialing keypad available on any mobile phone for easy number entry (?? did you measure this or are you assuming due to the screen size..because the dialpad doesn't tak eup te ENTIRE 3.5" or you wouldn't know what you were dialing)
    16. The stability and reliability and security that comes with OS X and LLVM. (questionable - wit until you actually try it rather than assume such!)
    17. That incredible scrolling with rubber band effects mirroring real physics effects ( not sure how real that is as I didn't calculate the physics - a bit rusty with that subject..but it looks cool so check)
    18. THE BEST mobile browsing experience... period. ( eh - relative! Some may say having to zoom abcka nd forth constantly to read a web page is a pain - so this is opinionated and not "period")
    19. Easiest conference call management I have ever seen. (ok opinion so check)
    20. A true web applications platform for a mobile phone. With Safari, now apps can be developed for any desktop computer and the iPhone. (eh? Any phone with a safari-like browser can do that which i hear includes SE handsets - that was a lame excuse for apps..plus it can't do flassh or java so those apps won't be available sans updates)
    21. Internet content is not determined by the carrier (who wants to sell the user something), as is the case with every other phone that can utilize the internet. (???? come again? same on the N95 i suppose)
    22. Coolest implementation of Google Maps I have ever seen (ok check opinion)
    23. Access to YouTube videos with no extra charge. This is unlike other offerings where carries have mobile video plans that use the walled garden approach: accessible only with a monthly charge and giving only short clips. (eh all those other choices are free to if you know how to type URL addresses - read up on that again)
    24. Widgets and applications that provide quick, good-looking and easy to use net based services.
    25. Push-IMAP support like a Blackberry, not that fake pushing either. (is that so?)
    26. Continual surveying of wi-fi availability with automatic switching. Previously joined networks are quietly and seamless connected to. (hmmm...I'll check you on that for now)
    27. Appropriate and usable visual cues within the slickest user interface I have ever seen. (opinion, check - i've seen slicker on PCs)
    28. It doesn't have carrier logos plastered all over it. (??? niether do unlocked phones)
    29. It uses a quad-band GSM radio which allows it to be used in every country except Japan. ( hmm..or at least it would if it wassn't Sim locked..but theoretically checked)
    30. Context sensitive keyboard that pops up when needed. This is extremely useful and really well done. (check)
    31. Bizarre and unheard of concepts like "touching your music" and "Visual Voicemail" (random access) actually make sense in using the iPhone. (??? if you have a touchscreen and the app you can do taht with any other phone...I can touch music in my ptunes catalog...and if they allowed visual voicemail on my network I could touch it too witht he iPhone there is no choice you MUST touch)
    32. Voice mail scrubbing. Lets you scrub through the voice mail timeline to quickly get to where you want. (check - once again though a networrk feature limited to the iPhone ratherr than the hardware)
    33. Voice mail is sent to you - like push e-mail. You can listen to and review your voice mail on a train or on a plane, without the need of carrier reception. (but you need internet? just as limited)
    34. Coverflow browsing of music and media. Plus, you can flick an album and it spins around to reveal the song list to choose from on the back... just like physical albums. (check, if that's your bag)
    35. The iPhone screen faade can actually be quickly and simply wiped clean with its unique edgeless, no-bezel design. This is to say nothing of the specially selected screen material chosen for use with grimy, greasy fingers. (I'll wait to test that one!)
    36. An external speaker (for speakerphone functionality AND iPod use) that doesn't get covered up when you lay it down like every other phone on the market. Thank you. ( check, but we have eyt to see how good it really is given it's size)
    37. iPhone's antenna is located in the back part of the phone at the very bottom. Very considerate for those with radiation concerns. Never understood why manufacturers continue placing the antenna as close to your head as possible. (radiation "radiates"...doesn't matter that the souce is 5 mm further or 5 cm further..if a device has radiation best bet is to be 10 ft away so that doesn't hold)
    38. Fully charged battery will provide up to 6 hours of internet use, 7 hours of video playback, 8 hours of talk time, 24 hours of audio playback, 250 hours of standby time This is unbelievable performance. (not with that size internal batterry, but I'll "check" it anyway)
    39. Context sensitive, smoothly transforming control surfaces provide an intuitive user interface. (didn't you mention this earleir?)
    40. Big bubble editing lets you touch and hold the screen to get a zoomed in area of text for precise cursor placement with your finger. ( again GUI mentioned earlier for keyboard)
    41. The keyboard - I know a little bit about what they are doing to make this unique keyboard a success. Every little space on that screen is tracking and measuring and relating to every other little space. There is a great deal of processing power required JUST for the simple act of typing. And reading how your finger hits the screen and what part of your finger hits first and the total amount of space that it hits all in an effort to account for inaccuracies. There is a lot of research that has been done here. They even take into account a person's inability to accurately predict what part of their finger actually hits the screen. It seems that we fail to take into account the curve of our finger and how it actually hits the screen based on the overhead view we have in watching the screen as we type. Then of course there is the software based auto-correcting type of feature that analyzes which keys you MIGHT have meant to hit and figures out the word you wanted. And then of course word prediction. To this end, word prediction itself is also used in conjunction with a process of dynamically enlarging tap zones behind the scenes for virtually larger keys. (eh cut and pastng eh? well tht's a no no )
    ROTFLMAO..I thought since you weent so far out to compile your checklist i'd at least respond!
    06-28-2007 04:45 PM
  7. RICHINMJ's Avatar
    Here's my list of positives that no other phone has which is justification for me in sacrificing a couple of features.


    1. It's Mac friendly.
    2. Revolutionary touch interface
    3. Two-finger stretching gesture
    4. Two-finger tap-to-zoom out gesture
    5. Two-finger pinching gesture
    6. One-finger double-tap-to-zoom in gesture
    7. One-finger scrolling gesture
    8. One-finger flicking gesture
    9. One-finger swiping/sweeping (depends on the context) gesture
    10. One button design - that lone button on the bottom of the phone will take you back to the home screen, provide quick accessibility to the iPhone's list of applications, provide a quick escape from the depths of any application or settings screen and act as a clean up/clean start tool - all with one quick press.
    11. Large 3.5 inch screen. Biggest camera view screen ever made.
    12. Thinnest phone available anywhere.
    13. High resolution screen provides 160 pixels per inch
    14. The most readable text (fonts) of any handheld device ever made.
    15. Largest dialing keypad available on any mobile phone for easy number entry
    16. The stability and reliability and security that comes with OS X and LLVM.
    17. That incredible scrolling with rubber band effects – mirroring real physics effects
    18. THE BEST mobile browsing experience... period.
    19. Easiest conference call management I have ever seen.
    20. A true web applications platform for a mobile phone. With Safari, now apps can be developed for any desktop computer and the iPhone.
    21. Internet content is not determined by the carrier (who wants to sell the user something), as is the case with every other phone that can utilize the internet.
    22. Coolest implementation of Google Maps I have ever seen.
    23. Access to YouTube videos with no extra charge. This is unlike other offerings where carries have mobile video plans that use the walled garden approach: accessible only with a monthly charge and giving only short clips.
    24. Widgets and applications that provide quick, good-looking and easy to use net based services.
    25. Push-IMAP support like a Blackberry, not that fake pushing either.
    26. Continual surveying of wi-fi availability with automatic switching. Previously joined networks are quietly and seamless connected to.
    27. Appropriate and usable visual cues within the slickest user interface I have ever seen.
    28. It doesn't have carrier logos plastered all over it.
    29. It uses a quad-band GSM radio which allows it to be used in every country except Japan.
    30. Context sensitive keyboard that pops up when needed. This is extremely useful and really well done.
    31. Bizarre and unheard of concepts like "touching your music" and "Visual Voicemail" (random access) actually make sense in using the iPhone.
    32. Voice mail scrubbing. Lets you scrub through the voice mail timeline to quickly get to where you want.
    33. Voice mail is sent to you - like push e-mail. You can listen to and review your voice mail on a train or on a plane, without the need of carrier reception.
    34. Coverflow browsing of music and media. Plus, you can flick an album and it spins around to reveal the song list to choose from on the back... just like physical albums.
    35. The iPhone screen faade can actually be quickly and simply wiped clean with its unique edgeless, no-bezel design. This is to say nothing of the specially selected screen material chosen for use with grimy, greasy fingers.
    36. An external speaker (for speakerphone functionality AND iPod use) that doesn't get covered up when you lay it down like every other phone on the market. Thank you.
    37. iPhone's antenna is located in the back part of the phone at the very bottom. Very considerate for those with radiation concerns. Never understood why manufacturers continue placing the antenna as close to your head as possible.
    38. Fully charged battery will provide up to 6 hours of internet use, 7 hours of video playback, 8 hours of talk time, 24 hours of audio playback, 250 hours of standby time This is unbelievable performance.
    39. Context sensitive, smoothly transforming control surfaces provide an intuitive user interface.
    40. Big bubble editing lets you touch and hold the screen to get a zoomed in area of text for precise cursor placement with your finger.
    41. The keyboard - I know a little bit about what they are doing to make this unique keyboard a success. Every little space on that screen is tracking and measuring and relating to every other little space. There is a great deal of processing power required JUST for the simple act of typing. And reading how your finger hits the screen and what part of your finger hits first and the total amount of space that it hits — all in an effort to account for inaccuracies. There is a lot of research that has been done here. They even take into account a person's inability to accurately predict what part of their finger actually hits the screen. It seems that we fail to take into account the curve of our finger and how it actually hits the screen based on the overhead view we have in watching the screen as we type. Then of course there is the software based auto-correcting type of feature that analyzes which keys you MIGHT have meant to hit and figures out the word you wanted. And then of course word prediction. To this end, word prediction itself is also used in conjunction with a process of dynamically enlarging tap zones behind the scenes for virtually larger keys.

    2-9 gestures are better used on things other than phones:o
    06-28-2007 04:46 PM
  8. surur's Avatar
    What are you talking about? You just randomly picked those out.

    I am giving you a chance to tell me why they are wrong.
    Originally Posted by archie

    11. Large 3.5 inch screen. Biggest camera view screen ever made.

    Obviously the full screen viewfinder on the HTC Universal, which has a 3.6 inch screen, is bigger.

    12. Thinnest phone available anywhere.

    The Samsung x828 is only 6.9 mm.


    14. The most readable text (fonts) of any handheld device ever made.

    How so? Does it use cleartype on a VGA screen with a higher DPI? Like my HTC Universal? I dont think so.

    15. Largest dialing keypad available on any mobile phone for easy number entry

    See above on my HTC Universal, not to mention the HTC Advantage with its 5 inch screen.
    17. That incredible scrolling with rubber band effects – mirroring real physics effects

    My HTC Touch has that.

    18. THE BEST mobile browsing experience... period.

    Without Java and Flash I think there must be many devices with higher screen resolutions which work better. UMPC's are also mobile device BTW. MySpace will work loverly on an IPhone - not!

    21. Internet content is not determined by the carrier (who wants to sell the user something), as is the case with every other phone that can utilize the internet.
    My internet is perfectly unencumbered, thank you.

    23. Access to YouTube videos with no extra charge. This is unlike other offerings where carries have mobile video plans that use the walled garden approach: accessible only with a monthly charge and giving only short clips.

    Heard of m.youtube.com?

    25. Push-IMAP support like a Blackberry, not that fake pushing

    I think you will find your Yahoo IMAP push is as fake as any other IMAP Idle push.

    35. The iPhone screen faade can actually be quickly and simply wiped clean with its unique edgeless, no-bezel design. This is to say nothing of the specially selected screen material chosen for use with grimy, greasy fingers.

    LG PRADA, HTC Touch and every non-touch screen phone disagree with you.

    36. An external speaker (for speakerphone functionality AND iPod use) that doesn't get covered up when you lay it down like every other phone on the market.
    My HTC Universal with its dual stereo speakers on the edge disagrees with you.

    Thank you.
    Ive been told I cant call you stupid, so I shall only advice you to avoid saying things like best, only and unique when you dont know what you are talking about.

    Surur
    06-28-2007 04:47 PM
  9. sxtg's Avatar
    I want to know which phone is thinner.

    In regards to carrier controlled, are you forgetting things like Sprint PCS and Verizons data service? What about Vodaphone?

    And then there is the issue of mobile web page squishing by these carriers and more.
    UPStage
    06-28-2007 04:48 PM
  10. marcol's Avatar
    36. An external speaker (for speakerphone functionality AND iPod use) that doesn't get covered up when you lay it down like every other phone on the market. Thank you.
    My E61 has a speaker on the side that doesn't get covered up.
    06-28-2007 04:48 PM
  11. archie's Avatar
    So it boils down to roughly 30 something different ways that it looks cool?

    Could be less as I dont have time to point them out, but glancing through your list I noticed a few that were the same "feature" just a different implementation.
    Yeh, I broke down all the gestures at the front of the list. I suppose that would be cheating.


    Still... I have to say that there are other things that I appreciate about the iPhone that are not on the list: some that other phones do have and some that I thought of just now that other phones don't have.


    Like those ugly scroll bars that take up screen real-estate. Apple allows scrolling of course but the scroll bars are context sensitive and cleanly implemented.
    06-28-2007 04:50 PM
  12. Malatesta's Avatar
    Here's my list of positives that no other phone has which is justification for me in sacrificing a couple of features.

    18. THE BEST mobile browsing experience... period.
    21. Internet content is not determined by the carrier (who wants to sell the user something), as is the case with every other phone that can utilize the internet.
    22. Coolest implementation of Google Maps I have ever seen.
    23. Access to YouTube videos with no extra charge. This is unlike other offerings where carries have mobile video plans that use the walled garden approach: accessible only with a monthly charge and giving only short clips.
    25. Push-IMAP support like a Blackberry, not that fake pushing either.
    29. It uses a quad-band GSM radio which allows it to be used in every country except Japan.
    36. An external speaker (for speakerphone functionality AND iPod use) that doesn't get covered up when you lay it down like every other phone on the market. Thank you.
    Just some random thoughts...

    #18 only applies to Wifi connections, which is not that mobile. Waiting 2 mins for a web page to load over EDGE is not "THE BEST".

    #21 is false as every WM has open access to the full internet. You can even select 3rd party proxy servers like opendns.com for faster DNS resolution.

    #22 Gmaps looks the same on WM except for resolution/screen size. We get directions, Traffic, etc. Not sure what is different. It even intergrates with address book.

    #23 On WM devices you can, albeit clumsily, download and view any Youtube content. On the Helio you can bypass their charge just by hopping to a different page. On WM devices (AKU 3+) you can use HTC's streaming video application (free) to stream any Youtube video.

    #25 There are many solutions for this on WM including eMoze, PushEffect, etc. That's also besides free Exchange hosting for push email and full syncing.

    Hotmail is also push now on WM6.

    "Real" push from Yahoo? Sounds quite lame. You have to pay to have it reflect a business/professional email address when sent.

    #29
    is nice except you have to pay international roaming charges, as opposed to just popping in a new SIM card. Very expensive.

    #36 Pogue said the speaker is "weak" for conference calls (vibrate was weak too). Devices like the Moto Q have nubs on them so that the speaker is not flush with a hard surface. Plus it has two and they are stereo.
    06-28-2007 04:51 PM
  13. RICHINMJ's Avatar
    My E61 has a speaker on the side that doesn't get covered up.
    Celebrate good times!!!
    06-28-2007 04:52 PM
  14. mikec#IM's Avatar
    I want to know which phone is thinner.

    In regards to carrier controlled, are you forgetting things like Sprint PCS and Verizons data service? What about Vodaphone?

    And then there is the issue of mobile web page squishing by these carriers and more.
    Let's start with the Moto SLVR; there a a few others.

    I'm not following on the carrier data service - Sprint data services are wide open...and the "squishing" of pages is by the browser app; there are browsers that left you go "full page" (that said, the Safari mobile edition looks pretty slick on Wi-fi; I'm not knocking it.)
    06-28-2007 04:53 PM
  15. sxtg's Avatar
    Yeh, I broke down all the gestures at the front of the list. I suppose that would be cheating.


    Still... I have to say that there are other things that I appreciate about the iPhone that are not on the list: some that other phones do have and some that I thought of just now that other phones don't have.


    Like those ugly scroll bars that take up screen real-estate. Apple allows scrolling of course but the scroll bars are context sensitive and cleanly implemented.
    The UI is gorgeous nobody is disputing that. I see the Iphone as being similar to that Suguaro app, of which I can say, It looks pretty....
    06-28-2007 04:54 PM
  16. mikec#IM's Avatar
    Ive been told I cant call you stupid, so I shall only advice you to avoid saying things like best, only and unique when you dont know what you are talking about.

    Surur

    Check and mate Archie. Once again, the trvth is out there.
    06-28-2007 04:56 PM
  17. surur's Avatar
    I actually missed that Archie claimed ALL of the things on the list are unique.

    Here's my list of positives that no other phone has which is justification for me in sacrificing a couple of features.

    29. It uses a quad-band GSM radio which allows it to be used in every country except Japan.
    Did he actually claim the iPhone is the only Quadband phone in the world?

    Archie, Archie, archie...

    Surur
    06-28-2007 04:58 PM
  18. marcol's Avatar
    Celebrate good times!!!
    Lol

    It is nice actually to not have a caller get muffled ( la Treo 650) just because you put the phone down on its back.
    06-28-2007 04:59 PM
  19. RICHINMJ's Avatar
    Lol

    It is nice actually to not have a caller get muffled ( la Treo 650) just because you put the phone down on its back.
    I actually have a TREO solution for that. I didn't like putting the TREO flat on its back cause I thought the camera could get scratched so I put a couple of velcro strips across the battery door (the fuzzy part). That lets me put it down virtually anywhere and it keeps it just high enough to hear the speaker. I also slid it to my firend on the bar the other day. Sent it about 10 feet down with no incident. Now that I'm not buzzed it seems like that was not a good idea but it worked.
    06-28-2007 05:05 PM
  20. Certs's Avatar
    Lol

    It is nice actually to not have a caller get muffled ( la Treo 650) just because you put the phone down on its back.
    You really do need to question (until tomorrow, of course) how well the speakerphone will do with the speaker right next to the mic
    06-28-2007 05:10 PM
  21. oalvarez's Avatar
    Just some random thoughts...

    #21 You can even select 3rd party proxy servers like opendns.com for faster DNS resolution.

    #23 On WM devices you can, albeit clumsily, download and view any Youtube content. On the Helio you can bypass their charge just by hopping to a different page. On WM devices (AKU 3+) you can use HTC's streaming video application (free) to stream any Youtube video.

    #25 There are many solutions for this on WM including eMoze, PushEffect, etc. That's also besides free Exchange hosting for push email and full syncing.

    #29[/B] is nice except you have to pay international roaming charges, as opposed to just popping in a new SIM card. Very expensive.
    Mal, just a couple of questions, just wondering what you think:

    #21 and #23....by the sounds of it you have to manipulate or do something different than what the out of the box device allows for. as for the youtube reference, you have to go through a couple of steps (so to speak) to get what it is that you're after. am i close?

    #25....you need a 3rd party application to get what you want

    #29....is there an expense/cost associated to this alternative of yours?

    regards
    06-28-2007 05:26 PM
  22. Certs's Avatar
    Mal, just a couple of questions, just wondering what you think:

    #21 and #23....by the sounds of it you have to manipulate or do something different than what the out of the box device allows for. as for the youtube reference, you have to go through a couple of steps (so to speak) to get what it is that you're after. am i close?

    #25....you need a 3rd party application to get what you want

    #29....is there an expense/cost associated to this alternative of yours?

    regards
    No cost on any, but none work out-of-the-box
    06-28-2007 05:40 PM
  23. Malatesta's Avatar
    Mal, just a couple of questions, just wondering what you think:

    #21 and #23....by the sounds of it you have to manipulate or do something different than what the out of the box device allows for. as for the youtube reference, you have to go through a couple of steps (so to speak) to get what it is that you're after. am i close?
    The opendns.com reference was just pointing out flexible and open the system is e.g. choosing someone other than Sprint's DNS servers is pretty flexible. It is by no means necessary though and most don't do it or need to. Opendns.com is a nice system that you can use for laptops and Desktops for faster DNS routing.

    The youtube.com you do have to go through one step: installing the program. Unless you buy a certain new HTC devices that come with that app natively--then it's no different than any other device using m.youtube.com. In other words, it just happens that it was ripped and you can install it on just about any WM device in 1-click via a .cab file.

    Then it's just going to the m.youtube.com site and clicking a link, nothing more.

    The brute force method (downloading the file) take an extra step: you have to copy/paste (lol, sorry...) the video tag to a "handler" program (free) that downloads the vid and then opens it via TCMP. The benefit is great resolution as those are not m.youtube, but full youtube.
    #25....you need a 3rd party application to get what you want
    Depends, certainly not for Exchange. That's native. Not for push Hotmail, which is standard in WM6 devices.

    Whether those are better or worse than Yahoo is a personal decision.

    The other options are just that: options. Pusheffect is very fast and can turn any email account in the world into Push. That's nice, but you need unlimited SMS. Emoze (free) will also begin pushing Gmail soon, all server side not a pc re-route.
    #29....is there an expense/cost associated to this alternative of yours?
    regards
    I'm not sure I suggested an alternative outside of
    a) not having a "special" GSM card or
    b) having a 2nd "open SIM" slot that works with any SIM card

    Either could have been done I suppose had they wanted to.

    No cost on any, but none work out-of-the-box
    Actually, I think I've shown quite a few can work out of the box.

    Certain HTC devices do m.youtube streaming natively, they also do Exchange Push and Hotmail push natively. And if they are a GSM device, they can obviously take other SIM cards for international usage.

    If not an HTC device, then yes...it sometimes requires installing a piece of software.
    06-28-2007 05:43 PM
  24. archie's Avatar
    The HTC's camera view-finder isn't full screen.

    You said, "Without Java and Flash I think there must be many devices with higher screen resolutions which work better. UMPC's are also mobile device BTW."

    Yeh, I really want to hold a UMPC up to my ear.

    Addressing Flash, recent comments from the likes of Steve Jobs and David Pogue and an Adobe person, whose name escapes me right now, are suggesting that the iPhone will indeed get Flash.

    The Samsung x828 isn't that same thinness throughout the whole length of the phone. Plus, can't buy it here anyway.

    YouTube application doesn't have the browser overhead. Plus the iPhone will get the content via streaming AND it is scalable depending on EDGE connection or the amount of bandwidth through wi-fi.

    By the way, how much do you pay for your data?

    In regards to the iPhone's push email, it might interest you to know that it supports the open standard developed by Oracle (this is what Yahoo uses). So it is definitely NOT fake and it definitely IS the most efficient available - easy on the battery.

    LG PRADA, HTC Touch! Come on, you know these are no where near the same as what Apple offers.

    Addressing the the HTC Universal's speakers, I just checked and it has to be open to use those speakers. If you set it down without first unfolding it, it covers up that tiny phone speaker - which as usual is placed on the back, covered up.
    06-28-2007 05:44 PM
  25. syphex#IM's Avatar
    I love when people get so hooked on a product that pulling "facts out of thin air" like statements like this "Here's my list of positives that no other phone has which is justification for me in sacrificing a couple of features" get just ripped apart. I don't know why people can't just sit back and think about stuff they want to say and figure out if its even true before going onto a forum and posting like how archie posted and damn that must have taken him a long time to write and just having it being so false.

    I just find that funny... now Im all for people loving products but don't sit there and try to convice people about it with false info. Now I do think its a very cool idea to have an ipod with all its features combined with a phone but its nothing we haven't seen before. Don't try and convice people so adamently with out actually knowing the facts.

    People are really getting heated up in this debate and its over nothing. Discuss the pros/cons but don't force your opinion so harshly on other people.
    06-28-2007 05:48 PM
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