1. bruckwine's Avatar
    What breakthrough? The sensor thing is nice, but the visual voicemail is already on the market via CallWave for the desktop, and I know Avaya is set to offer it on nearly any handset (via carriers). Apple is evolving already existing functionality from other devices, there is nothing revolutionary except the marketing. I'm saying this as a prospective customer, so I have no axe to grind. It just seems to be a more elegant but not really more functional phone. In many areas it is actually less functional so it is hard to give it that 'revolutionary' tag. It is no Fidel Castro.
    How about RAUL Castro? I think it's good enough for Raul status *taps memo on qwerty hard keys ..iPhone = Raul*

    Seriously once this sinks below the $400 unlocked category i'll be getting one to play with (circa 2008?) but otherwise I'll stick to what I have now....
    06-23-2007 11:28 PM
  2. braj's Avatar
    How about RAUL Castro? I think it's good enough for Raul status *taps memo on qwerty hard keys ..iPhone = Raul*
    Thanks for that, made me laugh
    06-24-2007 12:33 AM
  3. beachtrader's Avatar
    Navigate your way to this Apple URL and scroll to the bottom. iPhone compared to (drum roll) business enterprise devices. Apple (the host of th web page) is directly comparing the iPhone (their non-business device by your description) to four other classes of "business" phones (Nokia, WM Smartphone, Blackberry, Palm Treo). Get it?

    Of course, they very carefully limit the features in the comparison to entertainment capabilities. Lame.
    I think you missed the point of this comparison. Apple is not comparing the iPhone to the others for the purpose of marketing the iPhone as an enterprise device but to the consumers who buy these other phones who use them as a hyped-up consumer device. They choose these features because those are the features the iPhone is after--not the enterprise support stuff.

    Just look at the first phone, the N95,--surely this is not a business related phone. But why is it there? Because it has some of the features the iPhone does. So, you put it on the list. Same with the Treo. It has some of the same features (play music, surf net, etc.). So it goes on the list too. It may not be a direct competitor as the market is slightly different, but it is enough you need to address because of the overlap. A consumer is going to consider both, at least in passing. But to say Apple is now targeting the enterprise market and therefore because they are missing feature x the phone is a flop and will never hold up against a Treo is extremely far reaching. Frankly, right now for Apple, there is far more money to be made in the consumer market selling the iPhone to consumers than to be selling the iPhone as a business device.
    06-24-2007 01:01 AM
  4. Dim-Ize's Avatar
    Seems like some non-informed business users will get iPwnd.
    06-24-2007 01:23 AM
  5. marcol's Avatar
    Might I also add this "comparison" chart that was fought over a couple days ago, who was made by none-other: Apple?

    Lets see, it's compared to a Blackjack, Treo 750, BlackBerry Curve (!), Nokia N95...
    It's a comparison with three business phones (Blackjack, Treo, BB) and one consumer phone (the N95). It's part of a press about battery life and a new screen and I think the point it's trying to make is that the iPhone has better battery life than the four phones it's compared too despite having a bigger screen and being thinner. I rather suspect that the 'competitors' were chosen to cast a favourable light on the iPhone battery life specs - i.e. small(ish) batteries and high power consumption (fast processor, biggish screens etc) - rather than as statement of the intended target market.
    06-24-2007 04:15 AM
  6. marcol's Avatar


    Yes, its blatantly obvious Jobs did not mean for us to compare his device to current smartphones....
    He did. That was in a section of the keynote about device design and his immediate and obvious point was that exposed keyboards take up space on the front of the device and are inflexible (you can't change the keys from app to app etc). Clearly of course there is an emphasis on text input in that slide and the iPhone has a requirement for text input - but if you look at the examples of when text input is used in the keynote (personal email, google maps, SMS etc) there's little indication of intended enterprise use.
    06-24-2007 04:30 AM
  7. marcol's Avatar
    ^^That said I think there is at least one indication that Apple perhaps has at least an eye on some sort of business use: the inclusion of Word and pdf viewers.

    As it stands though it's pretty hard to make the case that Apple really intends this as a serious player in the enterprise smartphone market. If they did wouldn't they have licensed corporate email (EAS etc), included Office compatibility beyond just Word viewing, added security features like remote device wiping, etc, etc? Perhaps they intend to go after this market down the road, but it seems very obvious that that's not the focus with this first gen device.
    06-24-2007 04:43 AM
  8. surur's Avatar
    Actual he continued to compare his phone to other smartphones, calling it:

    What we want to do is make a leapfrog product that is way smarter than any mobile device has ever been, and super-easy to use. This is what iPhone is. OK?
    Wow! I did not know he was so grandiose. Has he not heard of laptops?

    Surur
    06-24-2007 04:54 AM
  9. marcol's Avatar
    Anyway, let's not bury the lead. There aren't many reports of using the keyboard foe any length of time and this one finds that it really isn't very good. Sure it's just one person, an anonymous one at that, but it's the first report since Mossberg's. These are his less-than-thrilled first impressions:

    “They are claiming that through clever software they have figured out a way for this to be actually far more accurate and efficient than you think it will be, and I’m testing that proposition,” he said. “And I can tell you that in the first hour it works a little better than I thought, but I’m still not sure it works as well as a regular keyboard — and the first hour is not a very fair test, so I’m going to keep going at it.”

    http://chronicle.com/wiredcampus/art...his-new-iphone

    The Newton was widely ridiculed for its predictive text capabilities (which were hopeless in the first models). I wonder if the iPhone will suffer a similar fate?
    06-24-2007 05:00 AM
  10. marcol's Avatar
    Wow! I did not know he was so grandiose. Has he not heard of laptops?
    Perhaps you should replot the graph for him. I'm sort of surprised you haven't done that already
    06-24-2007 05:02 AM
  11. surur's Avatar
    Perhaps you should replot the graph for him. I'm sort of surprised you haven't done that already
    Maybe not yet, but to show again Jobs prefer to have his device compared to a high end smartphone:


    Surur
    06-24-2007 05:25 AM
  12. marcol's Avatar
    I rather suspect that one was selected for its price point. C'mon, you don't seriously think Apple are targeting this at the enterprise market, do you?
    06-24-2007 05:31 AM
  13. surur's Avatar
    He's going after the high-end phone market, which just happens to be occupied by smartphones, and claiming his is better.

    Surur
    06-24-2007 05:37 AM
  14. Kupe#WP's Avatar
    Clearly of course there is an emphasis on text input in that slide and the iPhone has a requirement for text input - but if you look at the examples of when text input is used in the keynote (personal email, google maps, SMS etc) there's little indication of intended enterprise use.
    Oh really? Like when Jobs says the following in his keynote?
    10:18am - "It connects to any POP3 or IMAP email -- Yahoo Mail, MS Exchange, Mac Mail... POP3: Gmail, AOL mail, and most ISPs... let's highlight one, Yahoo mail. Today we are announcing Yahoo will offer free push-IMAP email to iPhone customers. This isn't just IMAP, this is push-email, same as a BlackBerry."
    Hmmm - that almost sounds like he's comparing iPhone's email to a Blackberry's email.
    06-24-2007 05:37 AM
  15. marcol's Avatar
    C'mon chaps, we could bicker back and forth like this for hours, but you know and I know that this product is absolutely not designed for the enterprise market.
    06-24-2007 05:42 AM
  16. surur's Avatar
    We know, but do those prosumers wlling to spend $600 on a phone know this? If they watched the keynote they may not. He said its smarter than a blackberry, with a better keyboard, gets exchange e-mail and is easier to use. Why would it not work with enterprise?

    Surur
    06-24-2007 05:47 AM
  17. Kupe#WP's Avatar
    C'mon chaps, we could bicker back and forth like this for hours, but you know and I know that this product is absolutely not designed for the enterprise market.
    That's because we're adaptable mammals...sentient beings, if you will. Steve's not necessarily targeting us - he's after the pod-people - the ones that only ask "How much?" when Steve tells them to spend money. He only needs to whisper such phrases as "like a Blackberry" or "first time ever" and the assimilated begin drooling in Pavlovian fashion.
    06-24-2007 05:50 AM
  18. marcol's Avatar
    We know,
    Thank you!

    but do those prosumers wlling to spend $600 on a phone know this? If they watched the keynote they may not. He said its smarter than a blackberry, with a better keyboard, gets exchange e-mail and is easier to use. Why would it not work with enterprise?
    I've been soundly bashed here before hoping that users do their homework before they buy, but frankly if you expect it connect to your corporate BES because you saw a picture of it next to a BB Pearl, I think you deserve what you get.
    06-24-2007 05:57 AM
  19. marcol's Avatar
    He only needs to whisper such phrases as "like a Blackberry" or "first time ever" and the assimilated begin drooling in Pavlovian fashion.
    mmm.... Pavlov
    06-24-2007 06:01 AM
  20. surur's Avatar
    Thank you!

    I've been soundly bashed here before hoping that users do their homework before they buy, but frankly if you expect it connect to your corporate BES because you saw a picture of it next to a BB Pearl, I think you deserve what you get.
    Yet apparently 19 million people have already made up their mind to buy one, and are demanding their IT admins to give them access.

    Surur
    06-24-2007 06:50 AM
  21. Kupe#WP's Avatar
    mmm.... Pavlov
    Woof!
    06-24-2007 07:28 AM
  22. marcol's Avatar
    Yet apparently 19 million people have already made up their mind to buy one, and are demanding their IT admins to give them access.
    Hey, at least they're asking rather than buying and hoping. My faith in the American consumer is restored
    06-24-2007 07:39 AM
  23. surur's Avatar
    Hey, at least they're asking rather than buying and hoping. My faith in the American consumer is restored
    But while Apple is not marketing the iPhone specifically to businesses, there is little doubt companies will have to accommodate the thousands of employees and executives who will insist on buying the device.

    "As if that will stop people from buying them anyway when they hit the market in the US next week," writes Seth Weintraub, editor of Computerworld, in response to the Gartner report.

    "The reality is that no matter how hard IT administrators try, the iPhone will be snapped up by their employees - and not just the average Joes either. The device is a status symbol that will likely be bought by business leaders as the digital technorati. Try telling your CEO the iPhone doesn't play well with your IT systems."

    Mr Weintraub believes the iPhone will prove popular in business, in part because the Apple handset is expected to be easy to use, making some tasks faster and "companies love productivity from their workers".

    And also, he says, because "everyone knows that this is the phone to have".

    "As much as the enterprise IT guys will want to recite better specs for rival Windows Mobile devices, nobody wants to hear that. I can imagine any number of CEOs saying: 'I don't care! Just make the iPhone work on our systems!' And if it works for the CEO, you can bet the sales folk will want in on the action, too."
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main...wiphone123.xml

    You cant fight the hype.

    Surur
    06-24-2007 07:59 AM
  24. mikec#IM's Avatar
    IT depts will do whatwver their business wants, and if hooking up $600 PMP's to their network is what the execs want, so be it. I just thing when they have to sign off on the costs and risks, many will pause.

    The iPhone is an entertainment device/toy. It is not a "productivity" enhancer.

    GMAFB
    06-24-2007 10:19 AM
  25. marcol's Avatar
    Faith shattered. Time to sell MSFT and RIM.
    06-24-2007 11:14 AM
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