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  1. HandyDJs.com's Avatar
    http://blogs.techrepublic.com.com/te...24&tag=nl.e550

    After you read it, take a sec & cast a vote. This should tell us a lot!
    06-13-2007 04:43 PM
  2. zelgo#IM's Avatar
    We all bought so many 3rd party programs for Treo because they are programs the Treo SHOULD have had but didn't. (A good video and audio player, a good photo displayer, Card Export-like program which makes the treo show up like a drive on your computer, TreoGuard, etc)

    If the iPhone has this stuff built in, you won't need 3rd party programs.
    06-13-2007 04:58 PM
  3. Certs's Avatar
    SLINGBOX

    Of course it matters, but without 3G what good is it anyway...
    06-13-2007 05:21 PM
  4. MacUser's Avatar
    We all bought so many 3rd party programs for Treo because they are programs the Treo SHOULD have had but didn't. (A good video and audio player, a good photo displayer, Card Export-like program which makes the treo show up like a drive on your computer, TreoGuard, etc)

    If the iPhone has this stuff built in, you won't need 3rd party programs.
    I agree. And Steve, if you're reading this, we'll need a good Password protection program please
    06-13-2007 05:27 PM
  5. surur's Avatar
    We all bought so many 3rd party programs for Treo because they are programs the Treo SHOULD have had but didn't. (A good video and audio player, a good photo displayer, Card Export-like program which makes the treo show up like a drive on your computer, TreoGuard, etc)

    If the iPhone has this stuff built in, you won't need 3rd party programs.
    Apparently it does NOT show up as a drive. See, already one of your needs unmet, and no way of meeting it either.

    Surur
    06-13-2007 05:27 PM
  6. davidg4781's Avatar
    Why wouldn't it show up as a drive? You can have an iPod mount as one, how would this be any different?

    And didn't y'all watch the WWDC keynote? The iPhone is going to have 3rd party apps, only they'll be contained within Safari.

    Here's an app called <a href="http://onetrip.org/" target="_blank">OneTrip</a>. Some guy developed it awhile back as a substitute for 3rd party apps. It's actually pretty neat and, personally, I like it a lot better than the shopping apps I tried last year for the Treo. You do have to have Safari to check it out, and it works on the Windows version also.

    I went through all of my apps and, honestly, couldn't think of any that would not work with this type of environment. Although, I don't have an extensive library, so I'd like to hear other people's apps that might not work out this way.
    06-13-2007 05:44 PM
  7. surur's Avatar
    Why wouldn't it show up as a drive? You can have an iPod mount as one, how would this be any different?

    And didn't y'all watch the WWDC keynote? The iPhone is going to have 3rd party apps, only they'll be contained within Safari.

    Here's an app called <a href="http://onetrip.org/" target="_blank">OneTrip</a>. Some guy developed it awhile back as a substitute for 3rd party apps. It's actually pretty neat and, personally, I like it a lot better than the shopping apps I tried last year for the Treo. You do have to have Safari to check it out, and it works on the Windows version also.

    I went through all of my apps and, honestly, couldn't think of any that would not work with this type of environment. Although, I don't have an extensive library, so I'd like to hear other people's apps that might not work out this way.
    Sorry, 9to5 mac reports that it DOES NOT show up as a drive, which is pretty understandable, because this would d be a good way to hack the IPhone, would it not?
    http://www.9to5mac.com/more-interest...ne-news-102353

    So, you talk about apps that dont work in Ajax. How about card export? No way to get that running in Ajax. How about being able to use your WIFI and full OSX to make VOIP calls? Cant because it wont run in Ajax. How about you want to watch watch video on MySpace - cant because it does not have flash. How about you download a Divx file, now you cant watch it without converting first. How about viewing those office files some-one e-mailed via yahoo? No native file readers.

    If you dont really use your Treo obviously an IPhone is ideal for you, but dont imagine its good enough for most smartphone users.

    Surur
    06-13-2007 05:58 PM
  8. davidg4781's Avatar
    Sorry, 9to5 mac reports that it DOES NOT show up as a drive, which is pretty understandable, because this would d be a good way to hack the IPhone, would it not?
    http://www.9to5mac.com/more-interest...ne-news-102353

    So, you talk about apps that dont work in Ajax. How about card export? No way to get that running in Ajax. How about being able to use your WIFI and full OSX to make VOIP calls? Cant because it wont run in Ajax. How about you want to watch watch video on MySpace - cant because it does not have flash. How about you download a Divx file, now you cant watch it without converting first. How about viewing those office files some-one e-mailed via yahoo? No native file readers.
    Surur
    Drat, I had written a reply and accidentally closed the wrong tab....

    Either way, it's odd that it doesn't show up as a drive, but, that may change after release. I'm sure it would be a simple fix.

    Now, on to the rest....

    What card are you needing to export? An Address Card? There's no card slot on it.

    There is also talk that JAJAH might be handling the VOIP for the iPhone, although I don't see why any other VOIP provider can't make a web app for this function.

    And I didn't know you could watch MySpace videos on a Treo. I tried awhile back on my 700p and it wasn't working. Maybe I needed to download something. As for flash and DivX, all that's needed is a plug-in for Safari to handle these types.

    Same thing goes for Word and Excel documents. Google has a great website to edit Excel and Word documents using Firefox. I don't see why anyone can't make a similar app for running in Safari. Who knows, maybe docs.google.com will run on it just fine.

    Now, do you have any specific apps that you're worried about? And, who knows, all these things might be fixed by the time it's released. As of now, we really don't know a thing about this device, other than it's generating a lot of buzz.
    06-13-2007 06:51 PM
  9. surur's Avatar
    Now, on to the rest....

    What card are you needing to export? An Address Card? There's no card slot on it.
    You dont want access to that 8GB? Jobs loves you.

    There is also talk that JAJAH might be handling the VOIP for the iPhone, although I don't see why any other VOIP provider can't make a web app for this function.
    Jajah is not VOIP, its just another web-based calling card service. It still uses your minutes.

    And I didn't know you could watch MySpace videos on a Treo. I tried awhile back on my 700p and it wasn't working.
    Thats because your Treo 700p does not support the full internet. Neither does the IPhone.

    As for flash and DivX, all that's needed is a plug-in for Safari to handle these types.
    Who's going to provide these plug-ins? Have you not heard that native third party apps are banned?

    Same thing goes for Word and Excel documents. Google has a great website to edit Excel and Word documents using Firefox. I don't see why anyone can't make a similar app for running in Safari. Who knows, maybe docs.google.com will run on it just fine.
    That will work very well over your dial-up connection -not.

    Now, do you have any specific apps that you're worried about? And, who knows, all these things might be fixed by the time it's released.
    Yes, Skype, TomTom, TCMP, DocsToGo or similar, SlingPlayer, Skyscape, Calligrapher etc. With no SDK none of these will be fixed.

    As of now, we really don't know a thing about this device, other than it's generating a lot of buzz.
    Yet people are prepared to pay $600 and hope for the best. Thats a sad commentary on humanity.

    Surur
    06-13-2007 07:14 PM
  10. MacUser's Avatar
    Now, do you have any specific apps that you're worried about? And, who knows, all these things might be fixed by the time it's released. As of now, we really don't know a thing about this device, other than it's generating a lot of buzz.
    Excellent points. The only app that I have a concern with is SplashID. I have grown TOO dependent on a good password storage program. I love that it syncs with my Mac, too.

    Directory Assistant is easily replaced with the Internet.
    Chatter won't be necessary.
    I'll miss Hi-Launcher a bit....hope things are easy to get to...what a silly statement, of course they will
    KeyCaps 600--probably not needed.
    MissingSync--bye!
    PowerRun to get stuff to my card so my 24mb aren't eaten up--gone!
    VolumeCare so I can hear who I'm talking to--well, let's hope not
    I almost forgot a used copy of pTunes...

    I just talked myself into a waiting line on the 29th...
    06-13-2007 07:25 PM
  11. oalvarez's Avatar
    i can really see the importance of a third party app for certain individuals but for the general public the apps that typically come loaded on Treos, Blackberries, iPhones? usually suffice. it all changes when those people try and turn their handhelds into their home pc, or TV for that matter.
    06-13-2007 09:24 PM
  12. llarson's Avatar
    They won't be dropping by with any good news on iPHONE just what they want to spin as the bad.

    Lets wait and see what iPHONE brings on June 29.
    06-13-2007 10:43 PM
  13. MacUser's Avatar
    I think the tone will be: How did you manage to get an iPhone? Or, How awesome is it? How many strangers have come up to you just to see it?
    06-13-2007 11:09 PM
  14. davidg4781's Avatar
    Skype - No reason why it couldn't, a small app that connects to the skype servers (I'm really not familier with it, so if I sound dumb, forgive me)

    TomTom - this might be difficult, since the maps take up a lot of space, but why couldn't they develop something with Apple to solve this, say a download through iTunes

    TCMP - it's an iPod. iPods play movies, videos, TV shows, Music, Audiobooks. Is there something that TCMP can do that an iPod can't?

    DocsToGo or similar - docs.google.com. There are probably others. Right now, google's not playing well with my excel spreadsheet on Safari.

    SlingPlayer - I see no reason why it couldn't run in Safari once an app is developed

    Skyscape - That may be one of the few, but there's always the possibility Apple will work with certain developers to work this out.

    Calligrapher - This may already be included, but you're going to be writing with your finger? I find it much easier to type and I've had both types of Palm devices.

    ------------------------------

    I think what Apple is looking for in a closed system is something that keeps just anyone from developing that have a huge effect on the whole system, like it currently is with PalmOS. Large, specialized applications, like Skyscape, maybe be granted special permission since they have the ability to work more closely with Apple, unlike small basement developers that make a majority of the applications for Palm.
    06-13-2007 11:26 PM
  15. Malatesta's Avatar
    Lets wait and see what iPHONE brings on June 29.
    In NYC?

    Muggings.

    Lots and lots of muggings.

    davidg4781, even supposing half of what you want could be done via Safari (it can't without access to the phone's internals e.g. volume, speaker, mic) you couldn't do the rest b/c of no bandwidth e.g. VOIP or Slingbox, expect over Wifi situations.

    The joy of TCMP is that plays just about every media file out there, not just iTunes library, which is what you will be limited to (presumably).

    Not to bring you down, but you won't be able to do a lot of that stuff. It'll be a great phone, music and video player though, just as advertised. Just don't expect more than what they are promising.
    06-14-2007 01:39 AM
  16. surur's Avatar
    Skype - No reason why it couldn't, a small app that connects to the skype servers (I'm really not familier with it, so if I sound dumb, forgive me)

    TomTom - this might be difficult, since the maps take up a lot of space, but why couldn't they develop something with Apple to solve this, say a download through iTunes

    TCMP - it's an iPod. iPods play movies, videos, TV shows, Music, Audiobooks. Is there something that TCMP can do that an iPod can't?

    DocsToGo or similar - docs.google.com. There are probably others. Right now, google's not playing well with my excel spreadsheet on Safari.

    SlingPlayer - I see no reason why it couldn't run in Safari once an app is developed

    Skyscape - That may be one of the few, but there's always the possibility Apple will work with certain developers to work this out.

    Calligrapher - This may already be included, but you're going to be writing with your finger? I find it much easier to type and I've had both types of Palm devices.

    ------------------------------

    I think what Apple is looking for in a closed system is something that keeps just anyone from developing that have a huge effect on the whole system, like it currently is with PalmOS. Large, specialized applications, like Skyscape, maybe be granted special permission since they have the ability to work more closely with Apple, unlike small basement developers that make a majority of the applications for Palm.
    Sorry, but if you dont understand why these apps are desirable and currently impossible the IPhone is probably perfect for you.

    Surur
    06-14-2007 02:40 AM
  17. davidg4781's Avatar
    Well, then you explain why Skype won't work via a web app.

    You've been pretty adamant about saying this will never work, only for those that don't require as much, but you haven't said why.

    How will a media player not play media? How will a web based document editor not edit documents in a web browser? How can someone not make an application that will allow you to view media in a web browser?

    Sounds to me this has already been done.

    Open your mind. Don't live in a beige box with Windows and act like your Palms are tied. Wait until people get their hands on this product and have the chance to get things going. There may be some out there right now.

    Remember, you've been playing around with a bug ridden Palm device, with crippled browsers and slow processors. The iPhone is a modern device with a full web browser (third largest) and one of the most stable OS around.
    06-14-2007 03:07 AM
  18. taroliw's Avatar
    As for flash and DivX, all that's needed is a plug-in for Safari to handle these types.
    umm... and just how were you planning on installing that native plug-in on a device that you can't install anything on? Hmm... Face it, sooner or later you *need* native code extension on the box.

    Web 2.0 + Ajax is just new fangled J2ME as far as I'm concerned. And although I found some very useful apps when I was using a Nokia 6820 -- a form factor which I loved but a platform I learned to disdain -- they compare not at all to what's possible when you write applications such as those I use on PalmOS (or which those use on WM, for that matter).

    We can all hope that the commentator is right and the SDK is just delayed but Steve didn't want to fess up. Because if it turns out there really is no intention to permit application or even widget development, then Steve can just proclaim this a feature phone and call it a day.

    As for me, I'm absolutely NEVER spending smartphone $$ on a feature phone. I don't care who makes it.
    06-14-2007 03:07 AM
  19. taroliw's Avatar
    i can really see the importance of a third party app for certain individuals but for the general public the apps that typically come loaded on Treos, Blackberries, iPhones? usually suffice. it all changes when those people try and turn their handhelds into their home pc, or TV for that matter.
    And you just pretty quickly described the dividing line between feature phone users and smartphone users. It's OK if iPhone is a feature phone... but $600 retail for a feature phone? wow
    06-14-2007 03:11 AM
  20. surur's Avatar
    Well, then you explain why Skype won't work via a web app.
    With skype, you have software which takes an audio stream, and compresses it into a much smaller data stream, and send it over the internet. This is a resource-intensive process, and could not work with an interpreted language such as javascript. How you could not know this I can not understand.

    How will a media player not play media?
    But can it play the media you want to play? Obviously you are more than happy with Apple's offerings, but the Iphone only supports video in a few codecs, whereas software like TCMP does video in MOST codecs.

    How will a web based document editor not edit documents in a web browser? How can someone not make an application that will allow you to view media in a web browser?
    I see Google docs only support files up to 500 KB for upload. I guess you don't mind if Google keeps a copy of your company payroll or confidential business plan.

    Open your mind. Don't live in a beige box with Windows and act like your Palms are tied. Wait until people get their hands on this product and have the chance to get things going. There may be some out there right now.

    Remember, you've been playing around with a bug ridden Palm device, with crippled browsers and slow processors. The iPhone is a modern device with a full web browser (third largest) and one of the most stable OS around.
    Sorry, but you do not appear to understand computers very well. However if you are happy to play in Apple's walled garden more power to you.

    Surur
    06-14-2007 04:01 AM
  21. Pearl_Diva's Avatar
    We all bought so many 3rd party programs for Treo because they are programs the Treo SHOULD have had but didn't. (A good video and audio player, a good photo displayer, Card Export-like program which makes the treo show up like a drive on your computer, TreoGuard, etc)

    If the iPhone has this stuff built in, you won't need 3rd party programs.

    Almost every phone overlooks something. It's almost a given. Except Sony Ericsson. Their phones pretty much cover everything. They need to make more smartphones!

    Speculation is that there's no IM client on the iPhone. BIG oversight IMO, if that's true. Either Apple will have to provide the app later, or 3rd party developers could fill the void if Apple would let them! And that's only one thing they may have overlooked.
    06-14-2007 08:30 AM
  22. Pearl_Diva's Avatar
    Open your mind. Don't live in a beige box with Windows and act like your Palms are tied. Wait until people get their hands on this product and have the chance to get things going. There may be some out there right now.

    Remember, you've been playing around with a bug ridden Palm device, with crippled browsers and slow processors. The iPhone is a modern device with a full web browser (third largest) and one of the most stable OS around.

    I don't think Surur is a Palm supporter either. I could be wrong, but I don't think so.
    06-14-2007 08:38 AM
  23. marcol's Avatar
    Almost every phone overlooks something. It's almost a given. Except Sony Ericsson.
    They certainly haven't overlooked proprietary connectors and memory card formats OTOH, they appear to have overlooked stability on the P990.
    06-14-2007 08:43 AM
  24. marcol's Avatar
    I don't think Surur is a Palm supporter either. I could be wrong, but I don't think so.
    I think he's Steve Ballmer
    06-14-2007 08:51 AM
  25. Pearl_Diva's Avatar
    They certainly haven't overlooked proprietary connectors and memory card formats OTOH, they appear to have overlooked stability on the P990.
    That's the one annoying thing about Sony period, proprietary formats. But they cover almost all the wants of many phone users. Except no document viewer on non-smartphones, but then why would you need one on a fun phone?

    I never used the P990 so I don't know if it's stable or not.
    06-14-2007 09:23 AM
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