1. Pearl_Diva's Avatar
    What's so closed about Symbian? Just because Americans don't accept anything but what they know, have trouble with something they're not familiar with and end up giving up? Funny that much of the rest of the world seems to not have this problem with Symbian. Hmmm...
    01-10-2007 08:38 AM
  2. whmurray's Avatar
    Why don't you use your 680? That was the best price ever for a Treo!
    I do not use it because it does not compete with my 650. I do not use it because I could not get it to work with any of my four BT headsets. I do not use it because I have learned to live with the memory on my 650. I do not use it because the battery life is too short. I do not use it because it will not sync to my 650 configuration or use my software and licenses.

    Which makes my original point that price is not everything. So far the best offer that I have had for my 680 is $200- and he was trying to steal it.
    01-10-2007 08:38 AM
  3. Pearl_Diva's Avatar
    Yours is unlocked?
    01-10-2007 08:54 AM
  4. skfny's Avatar
    No one at Palm should be laughing at anyone. They should be spending all their resources to make sure the 680 and 750 delays never happen again.

    Apparently Cingular didn't want the 750 bad enough to get it out before the holiday shopping season.
    01-10-2007 09:20 AM
  5. Fender Doc's Avatar
    The Good and Bad of the iPhone (in my opinion):

    Bad:
    - OSX – will not attract business users unless they can access corporate e-mail and MS Word, Excel, etc.
    - Price
    - No swappable battery
    - No memory slot
    - Small memory – considering that it is made to watch widescreen movies, PIM info, phone functions, music, etc.
    - No UMTS/HSDPA – what were they thinking by leaving this out?

    Good:
    - the screen input is very cool (I still like the Treo QWERTY keyboard though)
    - thin is in.
    - BT 2.0
    - Built in WiFi
    - this should scare the pants off of Palm into developing future Treos with WiFi, more memory, thinner devices, battery life, bigger-better screens, Jog-Dial, etc.
    - competition is good for the consumers

    This may explain why Cingular dragged their feet on bring out the Treo 750?

    I know some early adopters will buy the iPhone (I might as a replacement to my iPod nano), but whose is the big market that is going to pay for this phone? What am I missing? Aside for early adopters, I simply cannot see whose is going to pay $600 for this iPhone.
    01-10-2007 12:55 PM
  6. littlewaywelt's Avatar
    The Good and Bad of the iPhone (in my opinion):

    Bad:
    - OSX will not attract business users unless they can access corporate e-mail and MS Word, Excel, etc.
    - Price
    - No swappable battery
    - No memory slot
    - Small memory considering that it is made to watch widescreen movies, PIM info, phone functions, music, etc.
    - No UMTS/HSDPA what were they thinking by leaving this out?

    Good:
    - the screen input is very cool (I still like the Treo QWERTY keyboard though)
    - thin is in.
    - BT 2.0
    - Built in WiFi
    - this should scare the pants off of Palm into developing future Treos with WiFi, more memory, thinner devices, battery life, bigger-better screens, Jog-Dial, etc.
    - competition is good for the consumers

    This may explain why Cingular dragged their feet on bring out the Treo 750?

    I know some early adopters will buy the iPhone (I might as a replacement to my iPod nano), but whose is the big market that is going to pay for this phone? What am I missing? Aside for early adopters, I simply cannot see whose is going to pay $600 for this iPhone.
    everyone that has an ipod, loves it's out of the box simplicity and wants mobile access to email and pim data. Biz users? No. That's not who this device is targeted at. A treo is pretty limited out of the box. You know the apple will be incredibly easy and powerful enough for the average guy.
    No one thought ppl would pay $400 for a device that holds hundreds / a couple of thousand songs either. iPhone will be huge. People will understand that a) it's a good & stable product b) it will be easy to use and c) has an elegance form factor that's years ahead of anything else. People gobbled up razors when they were a couple hundred bucks.
    01-10-2007 01:06 PM
  7. Keefer Lucas's Avatar
    How many people are willing to change carriers or pay a termination fee just to get a new phone, cool as it may be?
    01-10-2007 01:09 PM
  8. Chatter's Avatar
    There are some things that most people dont understand. Wifi (in or out) is decided upon primarily by the CARRIER; its not as though Palm doesnt want Wifi or cant do it (the T|X and LifeDrive do it, right; think about it). And BT 2.0 and size will all be addressed, of course. Once Apple gets into this insane carrier-based world, things will get mighty complicated - I suspect that dealing with one carrier (Cingular) will be painful enough.

    Marc
    01-10-2007 01:22 PM
  9. Tastypeppers's Avatar
    There are some things that most people dont understand. Wifi (in or out) is decided upon primarily by the CARRIER; its not as though Palm doesnt want Wifi or cant do it (the T|X and LifeDrive do it, right; think about it). And BT 2.0 and size will all be addressed, of course. Once Apple gets into this insane carrier-based world, things will get mighty complicated - I suspect that dealing with one carrier (Cingular) will be painful enough.

    Marc
    Thanks for the comments, Marc. We (well, it's probably just me) don't get all of the variables at work in this game. You're right--it is to simplistic to think that a hardware manufacturer can make a decision without considering the (ahem) input from the carriers.
    01-10-2007 01:56 PM
  10. Trevante's Avatar
    There are some things that most people dont understand. Wifi (in or out) is decided upon primarily by the CARRIER; its not as though Palm doesnt want Wifi or cant do it (the T|X and LifeDrive do it, right; think about it). And BT 2.0 and size will all be addressed, of course. Once Apple gets into this insane carrier-based world, things will get mighty complicated - I suspect that dealing with one carrier (Cingular) will be painful enough.

    Marc
    I think that is for the most part, incorrect.

    The reason why the PalmOS Treo's don't support wifi is because of PalmOS's inability to multitask. It can't handle a cellular radio and a wifi radio at the same time. WM on the other hand, can multitask pre-emptively, allowing for wifi and cellular radios to operate at the same time. The Palm PDA's do not have a cellular radio an thus they can operate the wifi radio.

    The reason why the WM Treos don't have wifi is because Palm is slow to advance their hardware. Most other higher end (and even some basic ones) WM phones (Some that even cost less than the 700w| wx and 750) have wifi. Palm could have put it in, but they chose not to. Maybe because of cost (I doubt adding wifi can be that expensive), or because they felt it wasn't necessary. Or maybe they're just plain lazy, who knows?

    IMO, I don't think the carriers have such a big say as to whether the device gets wifi or not, especially if the device isn't exclusive to that carrier. Not to mention that every major carrier has other phones that have wifi on them, so there's no reason why they'd suddenly say "Yea, the 6700, Dash, SDA and MDA/8125 can have wifi, but the Treo 700w|wx and 750 can't, or we won't sell them".

    As for Palm and BT 2.0, I think we'll see that happening whenever BT 3.0 or 4.0 is out. Like I said, Palm is a bit slow to advance on their hardware, and they're certainly not known for having the best bluetooth.....

    In regards to the iPhone, I don't think it was wise for Apple to make it Cingular exclusive. The thing about he iPod that made it sucesssful was that everybody could use it. Mac, PC, and even Linux (with 3rd party programs). There aren't many requirements you have to fulfill in order to fully utilize an iPod. But with the iPhone, you HAVE to be a Cingular customer, which already locks out millions of people, unless they want to switch, which isn't an option for a large percentage of those millions of people.

    Once you get past the Cingular exclusivity, then comes the fact that there's no CDMA version (or at least none has been announced), which locks out Sprint, Verizon, MetroPCS, Altel, and other CDMA carriers.

    Next, the price of the iphone. The 4GB version is $500 with a 2 year contract. I don't think most people are gonna go for that. And without a contract, it's even more expensive.

    The iPhone looks ok to me so far (I don't see what's so thrilling about it yet), but I think the price, Cingular exclusivity, and lack of a CDMA counterpart will hold it back from saturating the market to it's full potential.
    01-10-2007 01:58 PM
  11. whmurray's Avatar
    Yours is unlocked?
    Yes. Comes with a 1G SD card and Palm Music Application. Offers? Anybody? Had some value day before yesterday.
    01-10-2007 02:10 PM
  12. Chatter's Avatar
    Trevante - With all respect, you're just wrong about carriers and Wifi.

    Marc
    01-10-2007 02:12 PM
  13. Trevante's Avatar
    Trevante - With all respect, you're just wrong about carriers and Wifi.

    Marc
    Could you at least explain why and how you know this?
    01-10-2007 02:13 PM
  14. whmurray's Avatar
    How many people are willing to change carriers or pay a termination fee just to get a new phone, cool as it may be?
    In a heart beat.

    That said, I avoid long term contracts. I pay the "termination fee" up front.
    01-10-2007 02:13 PM
  15. whmurray's Avatar
    No one at Palm should be laughing at anyone. They should be spending all their resources to make sure the 680 and 750 delays never happen again.

    Apparently Cingular didn't want the 750 bad enough to get it out before the holiday shopping season.
    I would like to think Palm stopped laughing when their stock cratered.

    I do not think Cingular ever gave the 750 a second thought.
    01-10-2007 02:18 PM
  16. whmurray's Avatar
    Thanks for the comments, Marc. We (well, it's probably just me) don't get all of the variables at work in this game. You're right--it is to simplistic to think that a hardware manufacturer can make a decision without considering the (ahem) input from the carriers.
    If Palm can, they do not. Craven? Yes, I think that is the right word. No one ever said that about Apple. Apple leads.
    01-10-2007 02:21 PM
  17. mobileman's Avatar
    Newsweek list of ten companies that should fear the iPhone. Guess who made number 1 on the list....

    http://mytech.talk.newsweek.com/default.asp?item=424985
    01-10-2007 02:31 PM
  18. Pearl_Diva's Avatar
    Concerning wifi in the case of Palm, Palm itself admitted they don't really care about putting wifi on Treos. "We'll put it on when the time is right", remember that statement when they introduced the 750v? What's that mean exactly? Also, they supposedly can't on Palm OS Treos because the OS can't handle 3 radios.

    Most other phones, I'll agree Cingular crippled the wifi on a LOT of devices!
    01-10-2007 02:34 PM
  19. littlewaywelt's Avatar
    How many people are willing to change carriers or pay a termination fee just to get a new phone, cool as it may be?
    Me.

    I've been with Verizon Mobile, then Bell Atlantic Mobile since 1984.
    I'll happilly pay the termination fee, sell my 700w for whatever I can get for it and pick up a pair of the iPhones for my wife and myself.
    01-10-2007 02:36 PM
  20. Pearl_Diva's Avatar
    But when it comes product design leadership, the company has devolved into a slow-footed follower,

    So true, unfortunately.
    01-10-2007 02:43 PM
  21. mobileman's Avatar
    There are some things that most people dont understand. Wifi (in or out) is decided upon primarily by the CARRIER; its not as though Palm doesnt want Wifi or cant do it (the T|X and LifeDrive do it, right; think about it). And BT 2.0 and size will all be addressed, of course. Once Apple gets into this insane carrier-based world, things will get mighty complicated - I suspect that dealing with one carrier (Cingular) will be painful enough.

    Marc

    Why do other smartphones spread across Verizon, Sprint, Tmobile and Cingular offer WiFI?

    The 8525 that runs the same OS as the 750 on Cingular offers Wi-fi. No more excuses for Palm.
    01-10-2007 02:45 PM
  22. whmurray's Avatar
    Concerning wifi in the case of Palm, Palm itself admitted they don't really care about putting wifi on Treos. "We'll put it on when the time is right", remember that statement when they introduced the 750v? What's that mean exactly? Also, they supposedly can't on Palm OS Treos because the OS can't handle 3 radios.

    Most other phones, I'll agree Cingular crippled the wifi on a LOT of devices!
    When the competition forces it? Too late.
    01-10-2007 02:46 PM
  23. Pearl_Diva's Avatar
    No, they just don't care. Competition already forced it and they still refuse to respond. But I guess we should be happy they at least have sense enough to use 3G.
    01-10-2007 03:23 PM
  24. whmurray's Avatar
    No, they just don't care. Competition already forced it and they still refuse to respond. But I guess we should be happy they at least have sense enough to use 3G.
    3G and CDMA. 3G and WM. No 3G and POS.
    01-10-2007 03:42 PM
  25. Pearl_Diva's Avatar
    You mean no GSM Palm OS 3G. OS can't handle UMTS, so I've read. Palm's OLD OS can't handle several things, it seems. :shake:
    01-10-2007 04:03 PM
137 ... 23456
LINK TO POST COPIED TO CLIPBOARD