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  1. cornettbr's Avatar
    After this years keynote we are seeing three years in a row of very small updates. This reminds me of RIM with blackberry how they essentially re-released the same phone over and over again insisting that was what people wanted so that’s what they are making. Short of being invested into the ecosystem, do you ever wish iPhone would implement some of its competitors finer features? Do you think Apple will sink if they don’t keep up?

    I’m already jealous of google assistant being able to field calls on the pixel. I had that feature on my work pixel and it was freaking amazing. What’s that? you’re a robot dialer have fun speaking to my robot ya punks!
    Seriously Apple needs to come up with something similar or something significant next year for me to buy another. I’m already on the fence. While I’m seriously invested in the Apple ecosystem I’d hate to leave due to stagnant / underwhelming incremental phone updates.

    Yeah I like the new green 11 pro max with an extra five hour battery life, but those are the only two things I like about the phone. Do I need it? No. Do I want to upgrade? I mean sort of just to get the green phone but I’m not going to be super excited for the package to drop off tracking every second of shipping like I did when the X came out. I was so pumped for FaceID.

    Anyone else?
    Last edited by Just_Me_D; 09-14-2019 at 08:46 AM.
    tr1ad and mweber67 like this.
    09-10-2019 11:07 PM
  2. BreakingKayfabe's Avatar
    You make really good points but I think you’re really stretching it with the RIM comparison.
    09-11-2019 12:48 AM
  3. FFR's Avatar
    Don’t thinks so op.

    Pixels don’t really sell well to begin with.
    09-11-2019 01:45 AM
  4. wilber1's Avatar
    Apple can hardly be compared to Rim after 11 years of devices and for my money No Pixel or Samsung , just wait until 2020 reportedly new generation of iPhones .
    09-11-2019 05:32 AM
  5. randall2580's Avatar
    The feature you mentioned was so compelling for the Pixel 3, they actually sold LESS Pixel 3's then they did Pixel 2's. Only when they introduced the cut-price Pixel 3a did the Pixel gain any traction what-so-ever.

    Apple, like RIM, competes in the marketplace with all the other phones. You even mention in your comment one of the compelling reasons why folks are in iPhone in the first place, the way it integrates with all the other Apple gear.

    If you go over to Android Central and read the forums on just about every phone, folks are bemoaning the basic lack of being wowed by everything coming out these days. Phones haven't changed much in a while - though 5G will be a big change if they ever get it fully deployed.

    RIM failed when they failed to realize, as Google did, what the original iPhone represented. When someone can innovate like that again, we can ask this question of Apple and all the other manufacturers. Right now, it's hard to point at anything thats significantly different.
    09-14-2019 08:18 AM
  6. kataran's Avatar
    No one knowing what the next big thing is keeps us all feeling like this personal communication device we all carry with us is stagnant.

    The Thrill is Gone

    My take on Apple is there following there Three year Form Factor recipe and I’m fine with that. Keeps me happy with my current IPhone X until the next generation of iPhones appear
    luvesuga and nikkisharif like this.
    09-14-2019 08:50 AM
  7. Just_Me_D's Avatar
    After this years keynote we are seeing three years in a row of very small updates. This reminds me of RIM with blackberry how they essentially re-released the same phone over and over again insisting that was what people wanted so that’s what they are making. Short of being invested into the ecosystem, do you ever wish iPhone would implement some of its competitors finer features? Do you think Apple will sink if they don’t keep up?
    Let’s take a step back for a moment. (1) Any company that is going under is the next RIM. (2) Apple is full aware of its “core” audience even better than those of us who hang out in tech forums. Yes, we are a small minority

    I’m already jealous of google assistant being able to field calls on the pixel. I had that feature on my work pixel and it was freaking amazing. What’s that? you’re a robot dialer have fun speaking to my robot ya punks!
    I’m not one of the people who are in to the Alexas, the echos, etcetera. I do use Siri, but I don’t talk to it like it’s a friggin’ i-Robot or Rosie from the Jetsons.

    Seriously Apple needs to come up with something similar or something significant next year for me to buy another. I’m already on the fence. While I’m seriously invested in the Apple ecosystem I’d hate to leave due to stagnant / underwhelming incremental phone updates.
    So your issue is primarily with iOS?

    Yeah I like the new green 11 pro max with an extra five hour battery life, but those are the only two things I like about the phone. Do I need it? No. Do I want to upgrade? I mean sort of just to get the green phone but I’m not going to be super excited for the package to drop off tracking every second of shipping like I did when the X came out. I was so pumped for FaceID.

    Anyone else?
    Nope. I’ve heard people mention what this brand has and what that brand has and what Apple has or does not have. There isn’t a smartphone available from ANY manufacturer that I’m pumped to run out and get. With that being said, what does that say about Apple’s competitors in my situation? Does that mean that they aren’t doing enough or does it mean that my desire to buy (regardless of brand) has changed?
    cwbcpa and nikkisharif like this.
    09-14-2019 08:52 AM
  8. Annie_8plus's Avatar
    I don’t think so! My justification for saying this is that so many reports indicate that the next batch of iPhones that Apple introduces in the fall of 2020 are be a significant update- and both design and software. This does not mean that I’m not impressed with the phones that they announced this week. If I were really in truly in the market I would really seriously considered the iPhone 11 Pro max. But I’m content with my 8+ right now so I think I’m going to wait until next fall.
    09-14-2019 10:54 AM
  9. cornettbr's Avatar
    Let’s take a step back for a moment. (1) Any company that is going under is the next RIM. (2) Apple is full aware of its “core” audience even better than those of us who hang out in tech forums. Yes, we are a small minority

    I’m not one of the people who are in to the Alexas, the echos, etcetera. I do use Siri, but I don’t talk to it like it’s a friggin’ i-Robot or Rosie from the Jetsons.

    So your issue is primarily with iOS?

    Nope. I’ve heard people mention what this brand has and what that brand has and what Apple has or does not have. There isn’t a smartphone available from ANY manufacturer that I’m pumped to run out and get. With that being said, what does that say about Apple’s competitors in my situation? Does that mean that they aren’t doing enough or does it mean that my desire to buy (regardless of brand) has changed?
    Well I don’t have a problem with iOS if I did I’d never buy an iPhone. My problem has been with the incremental upgrades every year. Don’t get me wrong I’m upgrading again, but mostly because I wanted the green phone. However it seems like the same old song and dance the last 3-4 years. New camera, strongest glass ever and improved processor. We got FaceID and that was fantastic. But there are plenty of things that android manufacturers do well that I’m a little jealous that Apple hasn’t done yet. I want the apple pen, USB-C, 4K displays, and yes some little changes to iOS would be nice. Like at least a weather widget.

    I like what apple has done with the ecosystem, it’s just the last two years they’ve been touting minor upgrades like it’s something absolutely revolutionary. There’s no reason why we couldn’t have had the extra 5 hour battery life on the XS Max last year. Why are they still selling baseline phones with 64GB of storage? I mean 128 I’d be all over it. But instead I have to have at least the 256 which means a lot more money.

    RIM had a great thing going for a long time. But they start rereleasing their phones over and over without adapting to the market and people moved on. I’ve seen more people this year disappointed with the new iPhone than ever. The biggest thing I’ve heard talked about is color choices rather than how great the phone is going to be. Maybe I’m being overly critical?
    nikkisharif and Just_Me_D like this.
    09-14-2019 11:21 AM
  10. Just_Me_D's Avatar
    Well I don’t have a problem with iOS if I did I’d never buy an iPhone. My problem has been with the incremental upgrades every year. Don’t get me wrong I’m upgrading again, but mostly because I wanted the green phone. However it seems like the same old song and dance the last 3-4 years. New camera, strongest glass ever and improved processor. We got FaceID and that was fantastic. But there are plenty of things that android manufacturers do well that I’m a little jealous that Apple hasn’t done yet. I want the apple pen, USB-C, 4K displays, and yes some little changes to iOS would be nice. Like at least a weather widget.

    I like what apple has done with the ecosystem, it’s just the last two years they’ve been touting minor upgrades like it’s something absolutely revolutionary. There’s no reason why we couldn’t have had the extra 5 hour battery life on the XS Max last year. Why are they still selling baseline phones with 64GB of storage? I mean 128 I’d be all over it. But instead I have to have at least the 256 which means a lot more money.

    RIM had a great thing going for a long time. But they start rereleasing their phones over and over without adapting to the market and people moved on. I’ve seen more people this year disappointed with the new iPhone than ever. The biggest thing I’ve heard talked about is color choices rather than how great the phone is going to be. Maybe I’m being overly critical?
    Believe me. I understand what you’re saying. Like me, you follow smartphone technology somewhat closely and thus, are a bit more aware than those who do not follow tech as closely.

    With that being said, Apple understands its core buyers and will continue to cater to them in the manner that has worked until it doesn’t. It’s like watching football. A coach will run the same play repeatedly until the opponent is able to stop the advancement.

    Tim Cook and others getting on stage and touting “the best iPhone ever” is a mere sales pitch to people like us, and their words go in one ear and out the other, but for their core buyers, I’m not so sure.
    wenrob and nikkisharif like this.
    09-14-2019 11:32 AM
  11. TgeekB's Avatar
    I think it’s comparing Apples (pun intended) to oranges.
    RIM was fully invested in one thing, smartphones. They refused to see the changing market and so that ship sank. Chen has now changed things and they are making a comeback as a security and software company.
    Apple is so much more than just a smartphone company. They get it. While they don’t lead the market in sales numbers they’re still doing equity well because of everything else they offer.
    I wouldn’t worry.
    09-14-2019 11:33 AM
  12. pantlesspenguin's Avatar
    I had 13 Android devices from 2010-2015 when I switched to iPhone. Since 2015 I’ve had 3 iPhones (soon to be 4). I spent years chasing the perfect device and I never found it on Android. Software glitches, hardware faults, rapid battery drains, inaccurate GPS...I went through it all. It felt like I was always at T-Mo for troubleshooting or getting warranty replacements. That all went away when I switched to iPhone. iPhones biggest feature for me is freaking stability. I know what I’m getting each time. Are new features cool? Absolutely!! And it seems like they’re doing a lot in the health sector which is awesome and I’ll fully take advantage of everything that pertains to me, especially now that I’m in my 40s. I’d much rather have things like that rather than gimmicks that are cool for like a day and then forgotten about.

    RIM failed because they had their heads stuck in the sand when it came to changes in their core market. They thought the pinnacle of business was....a physical keyboard lol. They touted “tools not toys” without stopping to think that touchscreen phones can be packed with tools for business, education, medical, etc. When RIM finally decided to get in the touchscreen game it was way too late, and their initial offering (the Storm) was laughably horrific, and they just never recovered even after releasing better touch screen devices down the line. By the time BB10 came out in 2013 everyone had long moved on.

    Do you honestly see Apple making these kind of missteps in the near future?
    09-14-2019 12:19 PM
  13. cornettbr's Avatar
    I had 13 Android devices from 2010-2015 when I switched to iPhone. Since 2015 I’ve had 3 iPhones (soon to be 4). I spent years chasing the perfect device and I never found it on Android. Software glitches, hardware faults, rapid battery drains, inaccurate GPS...I went through it all. It felt like I was always at T-Mo for troubleshooting or getting warranty replacements. That all went away when I switched to iPhone. iPhones biggest feature for me is freaking stability. I know what I’m getting each time. Are new features cool? Absolutely!! And it seems like they’re doing a lot in the health sector which is awesome and I’ll fully take advantage of everything that pertains to me, especially now that I’m in my 40s. I’d much rather have things like that rather than gimmicks that are cool for like a day and then forgotten about.

    RIM failed because they had their heads stuck in the sand when it came to changes in their core market. They thought the pinnacle of business was....a physical keyboard lol. They touted “tools not toys” without stopping to think that touchscreen phones can be packed with tools for business, education, medical, etc. When RIM finally decided to get in the touchscreen game it was way too late, and their initial offering (the Storm) was laughably horrific, and they just never recovered even after releasing better touch screen devices down the line. By the time BB10 came out in 2013 everyone had long moved on.

    Do you honestly see Apple making these kind of missteps in the near future?
    Do I see apple making these kinds of missteps? Of course I do. Apple isn’t infallible.

    One of the things they most recently did which is preventing me from spending more money right now on a new MacBook is making it completely unable to fix or upgrade at home. I’m still hanging on to my 2012 because I can replace the hard drive and ram on it fairly easily. If I wouldn’t have had the ability to do that I would have had to replace my laptop 2 years ago when my hard drive crashed instead it’s running strong still, admittedly it’s slower now than it was brand new.

    I think it’s small steps that companies take that eventually lead to their decline. They are still making great devices. However even if they started adding more “gimmicky” features to their phones they could absolutely turn many android users into iPhone users. I was one of those when they started making larger devices and I’ve stuck with them so far. But i won’t say I don’t go back and forth from Apple to android every other year, some android devices are as solid as apple devices (I’m looking at you pixel).
    09-14-2019 01:08 PM
  14. pantlesspenguin's Avatar
    Do I see apple making these kinds of missteps? Of course I do. Apple isn’t infallible.

    One of the things they most recently did which is preventing me from spending more money right now on a new MacBook is making it completely unable to fix or upgrade at home. I’m still hanging on to my 2012 because I can replace the hard drive and ram on it fairly easily. If I wouldn’t have had the ability to do that I would have had to replace my laptop 2 years ago when my hard drive crashed instead it’s running strong still, admittedly it’s slower now than it was brand new.

    I think it’s small steps that companies take that eventually lead to their decline. They are still making great devices. However even if they started adding more “gimmicky” features to their phones they could absolutely turn many android users into iPhone users. I was one of those when they started making larger devices and I’ve stuck with them so far. But i won’t say I don’t go back and forth from Apple to android every other year, some android devices are as solid as apple devices (I’m looking at you pixel).
    Oh I completely agree that Apple isn’t infallible. They definitely make some relatively small missteps. I’m not well versed on their computers because I don’t use them (I’m on my iPad Pro most of the time and I have a midrange Asus laptop collecting dust). The one thing I’m not too thrilled about in iPhone-land is offering 64gb to start. I would have much rather seen 128gb. Anyway missteps like that can’t really be compared to RIM twiddling their thumbs while others innovated. I can’t see Apple resting on their laurels for years letting others pass them by THAT much.
    Spencerdl likes this.
    09-14-2019 01:34 PM
  15. Westiemom's Avatar
    I always get a little amazed that some seem to think that smartphones should be completely new and revolutionary every year. We don’t expect that of cars. Automobile manufacturers make incremental changes each year and only do a total redesign maybe once (or twice?) a decade, but certainly not every year. Cell phones have become as essential as cars and as common, but some expect total overhauls every year. My theory is that we have that expectation because there was such rapid innovation in the beginning. We got used to that and it was exciting, but that ultimately slows down for obvious reasons.
    I think Apple is a little like a European car manufacturer in that it is classic and makes drastic changes less often while maintaining high quality. Hence great resale value too.
    Just my take. I was a long time Android gal also and have gone full Apple fan gal now I guess.
    09-14-2019 02:23 PM
  16. FFR's Avatar
    Oh I completely agree that Apple isn’t infallible. They definitely make some relatively small missteps. I’m not well versed on their computers because I don’t use them (I’m on my iPad Pro most of the time and I have a midrange Asus laptop collecting dust). The one thing I’m not too thrilled about in iPhone-land is offering 64gb to start. I would have much rather seen 128gb. Anyway missteps like that can’t really be compared to RIM twiddling their thumbs while others innovated. I can’t see Apple resting on their laurels for years letting others pass them by THAT much.
    Enterprise users love 64 gb on the 5.8 inch model.

    I would pick up an iPhone with 64gb of nvme ssd storage over any 256gb ufs based storage found on android phones.
    09-14-2019 03:10 PM
  17. pantlesspenguin's Avatar
    I just think it’s time for more, especially now that they’re putting so much emphasis on the new camera (granted, they always do). I have the 64gb X and I’m not even using half of the storage, but I am going through and deleting some pics and vids every couple months.
    09-14-2019 05:06 PM
  18. Tartarus's Avatar
    I just think it’s time for more, especially now that they’re putting so much emphasis on the new camera (granted, they always do). I have the 64gb X and I’m not even using half of the storage, but I am going through and deleting some pics and vids every couple months.
    Combined with the 200GB iCloud storage plan and having optimization enabled for iCloud Photo Library, you wouldn’t have to delete photos that often, or at all. It’s worth considering in your case.
    pantlesspenguin likes this.
    09-14-2019 05:29 PM
  19. Just_Me_D's Avatar
    I always get a little amazed that some seem to think that smartphones should be completely new and revolutionary every year. We don’t expect that of cars. Automobile manufacturers make incremental changes each year and only do a total redesign maybe once (or twice?) a decade, but certainly not every year. Cell phones have become as essential as cars and as common, but some expect total overhauls every year. My theory is that we have that expectation because there was such rapid innovation in the beginning. We got used to that and it was exciting, but that ultimately slows down for obvious reasons.
    I think Apple is a little like a European car manufacturer in that it is classic and makes drastic changes less often while maintaining high quality. Hence great resale value too.
    Just my take. I was a long time Android gal also and have gone full Apple fan gal now I guess.
    Outstanding response, ma’am...
    nikkisharif likes this.
    09-14-2019 06:03 PM
  20. G Y's Avatar
    RIM went under because their OS was stale and had not changed in years. Android came out and so did iOS and that was the beginning of the end for them. As many have said, phones have reached a plateau. It’s not just Apple. It’s android too. At this point, it’s getting the consumer to vote with their dollar now that each year we are getting less fanciful updates to OS.
    pantlesspenguin likes this.
    09-14-2019 06:31 PM
  21. Jude526's Avatar
    I am holding off until the 2020 models
    I am on the xs Max and love it. It suits my needs extremely well. I want to see the pencil be incorporated into use with the iPhone. I miss the spen but I don’t miss Samsung
    I wish Apple would listen to us!
    pantlesspenguin likes this.
    09-14-2019 06:39 PM
  22. falconeight#IM's Avatar
    Apple knows and understands its customers. We don’t want a brand new revolutionary phone every year. We want to feel that our phones will be relevant year to year. If they’re redesigning, that means they are trying to play catch up or justifying themselves. The best companies improve current designs. Porsche’s, Audi, bmw, Toyota, etc.
    wenrob and Just_Me_D like this.
    09-15-2019 01:23 PM
  23. falconeight#IM's Avatar
    I am holding off until the 2020 models
    I am on the xs Max and love it. It suits my needs extremely well. I want to see the pencil be incorporated into use with the iPhone. I miss the spen but I don’t miss Samsung
    I wish Apple would listen to us!
    Sounds like you’ll cave and get one soon.
    BreakingKayfabe likes this.
    09-15-2019 04:01 PM
  24. GokhanBas's Avatar
    After this years keynote we are seeing three years in a row of very small updates. This reminds me of RIM with blackberry how they essentially re-released the same phone over and over again insisting that was what people wanted so that’s what they are making. Short of being invested into the ecosystem, do you ever wish iPhone would implement some of its competitors finer features? Do you think Apple will sink if they don’t keep up?

    I’m already jealous of google assistant being able to field calls on the pixel. I had that feature on my work pixel and it was freaking amazing. What’s that? you’re a robot dialer have fun speaking to my robot ya punks!
    Seriously Apple needs to come up with something similar or something significant next year for me to buy another. I’m already on the fence. While I’m seriously invested in the Apple ecosystem I’d hate to leave due to stagnant / underwhelming incremental phone updates.

    Yeah I like the new green 11 pro max with an extra five hour battery life, but those are the only two things I like about the phone. Do I need it? No. Do I want to upgrade? I mean sort of just to get the green phone but I’m not going to be super excited for the package to drop off tracking every second of shipping like I did when the X came out. I was so pumped for FaceID.

    Anyone else?
    There is a lot of reasons why that isn't the case. I'll give you the top 2.

    1- iPhones are not getting less updates than before, actually I would argue they're getting more. Let's see what new phones brought in every iteration:

    iPhone 3G: 3G Radio
    iPhone 3GS: Faster processor, video recording
    iPhone 4: Retina display, Facetime camera, better camera, A4 processor
    iPhone 4S: Siri, better cameras, A5 processor
    iPhone 5: LTE, better cameras, A6 processor
    iPhone 5s: better camera, Touch ID, motion sensor, A7 processor, M7 processor
    iPhone 6: better camera, A8 processor, M8 Processor, ApplePay, Secure Element
    iPhone 6s: better camera, A9 processor, M9 Processor, taptic engine, 3D Touch
    iPhone 7: better camera, Portrait mode, A10 processor, new speakers
    iPhone X: better camera,A 11 processor, Face ID & Depth sensing, new UI, OLED display, better speakers, HDR
    iPhone XS: better camera, A12 processor, better speakers
    iPhone 11: wide angle cameras front and back, better camera, better screen, A13 Processor, U1 chip

    So no, iPhone is actually getting more upgrades both quantitatively and qualitatively.

    The ecosystem is getting amazing upgrades as well like Apple Watch, Airpods, and others.

    2- When RIM and Nokia were going down, Apple didn't have the marketshare, but they owned the mindshare. And that's when you go down: When you lose mindshare. And right now, Apple own the mindshare even more than they did in 2007. Their processors are 3 generations ahead, the ecosystem is infinite generations ahead, and every single year they top the customer satisfaction surveys.
    Just_Me_D likes this.
    09-16-2019 12:55 PM
  25. Mr Segundus's Avatar
    After this years keynote we are seeing three years in a row of very small updates. This reminds me of RIM with blackberry how they essentially re-released the same phone over and over again insisting that was what people wanted so that’s what they are making. Short of being invested into the ecosystem, do you ever wish iPhone would implement some of its competitors finer features? Do you think Apple will sink if they don’t keep up?

    I’m already jealous of google assistant being able to field calls on the pixel. I had that feature on my work pixel and it was freaking amazing. What’s that? you’re a robot dialer have fun speaking to my robot ya punks!
    Seriously Apple needs to come up with something similar or something significant next year for me to buy another. I’m already on the fence. While I’m seriously invested in the Apple ecosystem I’d hate to leave due to stagnant / underwhelming incremental phone updates.

    Yeah I like the new green 11 pro max with an extra five hour battery life, but those are the only two things I like about the phone. Do I need it? No. Do I want to upgrade? I mean sort of just to get the green phone but I’m not going to be super excited for the package to drop off tracking every second of shipping like I did when the X came out. I was so pumped for FaceID.

    Anyone else?
    The thrill is gone. I used to get every iPhone on release day, but this year's just seem so meh. Why give them money if next year's devices are going to be the real upgrade? I hate Apple's 3 year major upgrade cycle. Devices get stagnant after a year. Continue to wow us.
    kataran likes this.
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