1. circatee's Avatar
    Curious, why do YOU, use Spark on iOS (or Mac OS)?

    Currently, I am working with a vendor, and they use Spark (they told me about it).
    However, often, when they respond to an email chain, my part of the conversation does not show up (in Outlook for Windows).

    Rather odd. So, as an iOS and Mac OS user, I wanted to know what is the real benefit of using Spark. Hence, this thread...
    11-11-2021 04:41 PM
  2. Just_Me_D's Avatar
    Hopefully those who use Spark will rely soon. I tried it years back, but I don’t recall any of the particulars. Sorry.
    11-12-2021 10:32 AM
  3. metllicamilitia's Avatar
    Spark has a great UI and added some features for business teams a while back. It’s possible they are using those features and those don’t play well with Outlook, or if comes across as more of a forward with Outlook, or even just cause Outlook is weird, I find many times I have to click the ellipsis at the bottom of an email to see the previous messages. Personally, I just really like the UI and feel of Spark. I don’t use too many of the other features, but I like that it’s not just another box of squares with rectangles like every other super boring email client.
    aximtreo and circatee like this.
    11-12-2021 11:50 AM
  4. gnirkatto's Avatar
    I like Spark, and have been using it on all Apple platforms since many years.
    However, it's not for the additional features, like smart inbox, teams etc. that I prefer it over Apple Mail.
    In fact, I CANNOT use Apple mail, although I would seriously consider it, because of its integration in the ecosystem/stock apps.

    Apple Mail, instantly and unsolicited marks an email read, once the focus jumps to it (eg after deleting the previous mail).
    This is incredibly counter productive, and annoying. It made me forget/overlook many important mails already.
    With every new Mac OS/iOS version, I hoped for this to change, or for a setting to chose, but no.

    In Spark, this is not the case. You have to consciously klick on an email, then it gets marked read. Never before.
    A 'small' (?) issue, but makes the stock app unusable for me.

    Yes, I already sent this feature request to Apple, 10 times at least.
    But apparently I am the only one who gets annoyed by that, and nobody else.

    Besides all that, Spark is stable, reliable, has a nice UI, and as I said, offers a few features that may be of use for some. And, I have to say, support is fast, polite and competent.
    11-13-2021 01:11 PM
  5. FFR's Avatar
    I like Spark, and have been using it on all Apple platforms since many years.
    However, it's not for the additional features, like smart inbox, teams etc. that I prefer it over Apple Mail.
    In fact, I CANNOT use Apple mail, although I would seriously consider it, because of its integration in the ecosystem/stock apps.

    Apple Mail, instantly and unsolicited marks an email read, once the focus jumps to it (eg after deleting the previous mail).
    This is incredibly counter productive, and annoying. It made me forget/overlook many important mails already.
    With every new Mac OS/iOS version, I hoped for this to change, or for a setting to chose, but no.

    In Spark, this is not the case. You have to consciously klick on an email, then it gets marked read. Never before.
    A 'small' (?) issue, but makes the stock app unusable for me.

    Yes, I already sent this feature request to Apple, 10 times at least.
    But apparently I am the only one who gets annoyed by that, and nobody else.

    Besides all that, Spark is stable, reliable, has a nice UI, and as I said, offers a few features that may be of use for some. And, I have to say, support is fast, polite and competent.
    You could just turn off threading in the mail app, should solve your problem.

    Personably I prefer apples threaded email approach.
    11-13-2021 04:13 PM
  6. doogald's Avatar
    Apple Mail, instantly and unsolicited marks an email read, once the focus jumps to it (eg after deleting the previous mail).
    I agree with the gripe, but now I only delete emails from the list of messages, so this no longer happens to me. (So, in other words, if I want to delete a message, I return to the list of messages and swipe left to delete it.)

    Unfortunately, iPadOS still has the annoying "feature" of opening another mail message, even from the list of emails messages, and seems to choose which one to open randomly. I absolutely hate this behavior.
    11-13-2021 04:20 PM
  7. gnirkatto's Avatar
    I just tried this out (on the Mac) and disabling threading does not change the behavior. Regardless of how I deleted a (non-threaded) email, the focus jumped to the next/previous email (which I marked unread before this exercise), and marked them read.

    Maybe you understood the issue in a way that I didn't want the next email in a thread to me marked read? Sure, but mainly other emails, not belonging to the thread, showing before or after the email I just deleted.

    Anyway, I don't want to turn off threading, as I've been used to that as a convenient email feature since many many years. As are most people I know.
    11-14-2021 06:29 AM
  8. gnirkatto's Avatar
    I'm not sure I understand what you mean.

    'Return to list of messages' where from? If I read a mail in the preview panel (right of list), it remains marked in the email list. If I open the email (in its own window) and close it, it is still marked in the list, and as soon as I delete it, the effect I described happens.

    Could you explain what exactly you do?
    11-14-2021 06:35 AM
  9. gnirkatto's Avatar
    P.S. maybe my fault as I tested on the Mac - maybe totally different behavior than under iOS?
    (this doesn't change the situation for me, even if this can be avoided under iOS, as I'm doing emails on all platforms on a regular basis).
    11-14-2021 06:50 AM
  10. doogald's Avatar
    P.S. maybe my fault as I tested on the Mac - maybe totally different behavior than under iOS?
    (this doesn't change the situation for me, even if this can be avoided under iOS, as I'm doing emails on all platforms on a regular basis).
    As this is an iOS forum, of course I am talking about using Mail on an iPhone.

    On a Mac, i don’t have a preview window open, just a list of messages (which usually shows a couple of lines from the message). If I want to read an email, I open it from the list. The only way mails are shown as open is when I open them. (I wish iPadOS allowed this usage, as I posted earlier.) Basically when I delete a message, it’s from the list of messages, I press the delete key on the keyboard.
    11-14-2021 10:50 PM
  11. gnirkatto's Avatar
    As this is an iOS forum, of course I am talking about using Mail on an iPhone.

    On a Mac, i don’t have a preview window open, just a list of messages (which usually shows a couple of lines from the message). If I want to read an email, I open it from the list. The only way mails are shown as open is when I open them. (I wish iPadOS allowed this usage, as I posted earlier.) Basically when I delete a message, it’s from the list of messages, I press the delete key on the keyboard.
    OK, 2 things:
    1. unfortunately, mail on iOs behaves in the same way as on the Mac (in terms of automatically marking emails read)
    2. I tried to reproduce your method (on the Mac) but failed. 1st, I can't close preview, in no view at all. There is always one, and there seems to be no menu option to turn it off. 2ndly, if I change to 'columns view' (maybe what you call 'list of messages') , I can delete an email in whatever way I want (open email, delete symbol, or pressing the delete key on keyboard for a marked mail in list etc.), and it ALWAYS jumps to the previous or next email and marks it read, if it was unread before.

    Maybe I'm doing it wrong, however, my point is, I want to work quickly and efficiently with an email client, and use its first level features, without having to fear other unwanted things will happen that make me forget about important stuff.

    For me, Spark does that, on all platforms, Apple Mail doesn't (yet?).
    11-15-2021 03:35 AM
  12. doogald's Avatar
    OK, 2 things:
    1. unfortunately, mail on iOs behaves in the same way as on the Mac (in terms of automatically marking emails read)
    This is on iPhone. Tap on the inbox view. This shows your list of messages, probably with who it is from, the subject, and a couple of lines of content. Swipe left on a message to reveal a button to delete; keep swiping to actually delete the message. This is always how I delete messages. If I read a message by tapping it, I return to the inbox view, and then I delete it there (or archive, or move to a folder, etc.)


    2. I tried to reproduce your method (on the Mac) but failed. 1st, I can't close preview, in no view at all. There is always one, and there seems to be no menu option to turn it off.
    If you look at the preview window, there is actually a thin, draggable bar between it and the inbox view list of messages that you can use to make the preview window larger or smaller. Drag it toward the bottom (if you use bottom preview) or right (if you use side preview) all the way to the edge of the window to make the preview window disappear.

    This is what I want iPadOS mail to look like.

    2ndly, if I change to 'columns view' (maybe what you call 'list of messages')
    Nope, I never use column view.

    my point is, I want to work quickly and efficiently with an email client, and use its first level features, without having to fear other unwanted things will happen that make me forget about important stuff.

    For me, Spark does that, on all platforms, Apple Mail doesn't (yet?).
    That's fine. My issue with Spark remains that if you want push mail on iOS, they are storing your messages in their cloud, and I don't want third parties to have access to my mail. I'm sure it's a small risk, but I don't want to take it. Apple - I trust them more.
    FFR likes this.
    11-15-2021 05:03 AM
  13. gnirkatto's Avatar
    This is on iPhone. Tap on the inbox view. This shows your list of messages, probably with who it is from, the subject, and a couple of lines of content. Swipe left on a message to reveal a button to delete; keep swiping to actually delete the message. This is always how I delete messages. If I read a message by tapping it, I return to the inbox view, and then I delete it there (or archive, or move to a folder, etc.)




    If you look at the preview window, there is actually a thin, draggable bar between it and the inbox view list of messages that you can use to make the preview window larger or smaller. Drag it toward the bottom (if you use bottom preview) or right (if you use side preview) all the way to the edge of the window to make the preview window disappear.

    This is what I want iPadOS mail to look like.



    Nope, I never use column view.



    That's fine. My issue with Spark remains that if you want push mail on iOS, they are storing your messages in their cloud, and I don't want third parties to have access to my mail. I'm sure it's a small risk, but I don't want to take it. Apple - I trust them more.
    Could reproduce according to your hints, thanks.
    On the Mac - I was not aware that if you carry on dragging the border of the preview panel to the right, it will disappear. If you drag, it stops briefly, before allowing you to drag further. At the stop, I thought that was it.
    Will have to check if I can implement this into my workflows without major interruptions.
    Interesting what you said about them storing mails in their cloud. Are you sure? (I also trust Apple - more, not full ;-))
    11-16-2021 06:30 AM
  14. doogald's Avatar
    Interesting what you said about them storing mails in their cloud. Are you sure?
    Yes, they do, in specific circumstances. See https://sparkmailapp.com/blog/privacy-explained

    So, they are encrypted in a way that they say cannot be read by anyone. They say that the key is stored on your phone. That's pretty good probably, but here is what worries me: what happens if Readdle gets purchased by somebody bigger down the one and changes this workflow and policy? That's a risk with everyone, but seems so improbable with Apple.

    See number 1 in that page tough: They do store credentials to your email account on their servers, though. They are almost always tokens that can be deauthorized by you at any time (for example, with a Google or Outlook.com account), but I know that I have accounts that don't use Oauth (e.g., my ISP's email account). This is no different from almost any other third party email app, unless, of course, you are using Outlook only to access Outlook.com accounts, or the Gmail app to access only Google mail accounts.

    But, of course, for people who get productivity value out of using Spark's app, of course you have to make that risk v reward value judgement, and maybe the value is just too high. I'm ok with the stock mail app at this point, and will continue using it (until Apple messes it up, as they have done once or twice in the past.)
    11-16-2021 11:53 AM

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