1. gnirkatto's Avatar
    Sorry for asking a potentially silly question. I'm not a very experienced Apple user (yet?).
    What is the point of iMessage using iCloud now with iOS 11.4?
    New iMessage messages already synced between my iPhone and my iPad before 11.4., even to my Mac.
    So I have a new switch in settings to enable iMessage using iCloud now. What is new/different/improved?
    They only difference I noticed so far was that when marking a message read on my iPad, the notification will also stop on the iPhone, which, I believe, was not the case before.
    05-30-2018 03:53 AM
  2. gnirkatto's Avatar
    First answers to myself:

    deleted message on iOS #1 also disappear on iOS #2 . Not on the Mac (supposedly, a Mac update will follow soon to also include this feature).
    Older messages getting uploaded to iCloud only if on power supply and WiFi. Upload completed, but the older messages did not (yet?) show on the other iOS devices - so why did they even get uploaded?
    05-30-2018 04:14 AM
  3. gnirkatto's Avatar
    Older messages are now in sync between my iPad and the Mac (!?) - but only back to march 2018, no older messages.
    Absolutely no sync has happened to my iPhone - although iMessage on both the iPad and the iPhone synced up to iCloud, while being on charger and WiFi.
    I really don't understand how this is supposed to work.
    05-30-2018 04:44 AM
  4. robertk328's Avatar
    Messages in iCloud, as you mentioned, is meant to keep things sync'd across devices.
    Also means if you start with a fresh device, Messages should pull in when you enable iCloud. When starting with a fresh phone and no backup, you can get a lot of things back (Safari bookmarks, photos, etc.) but until now you would do without messages.
    doogald, Lee_Bo and TripleOne like this.
    05-30-2018 04:49 AM
  5. gnirkatto's Avatar
    Messages in iCloud, as you mentioned, is meant to keep things sync'd across devices.
    Also means if you start with a fresh device, Messages should pull in when you enable iCloud. When starting with a fresh phone and no backup, you can get a lot of things back (Safari bookmarks, photos, etc.) but until now you would do without messages.
    hm...any idea why I'm not getting any message history back to my iPhone, while all old messages were uploaded to iCloud from my iPad? Or, does this only work for new messages 'from now on'? But why were these older messages then uploaded at all?
    05-30-2018 05:15 AM
  6. gnirkatto's Avatar
    P.S. why have these *#&% IT companies stopped explaining clearly how their new features work ?
    05-30-2018 05:18 AM
  7. Lee_Bo's Avatar
    Yeah, I got the message at the bottom of the iMessages screen last night that I needed to be on wifi and have the charger connected.

    Today both iPhone and iPad are synced.
    05-30-2018 11:43 AM
  8. dadathepanda's Avatar
    I had my iMessages synchronized on my iPhone and iPad way before this update with the message forwarding function . How is this iCloud thing any different?
    05-30-2018 12:25 PM
  9. BreakingKayfabe's Avatar
    I had my iMessages synchronized on my iPhone and iPad way before this update with the message forwarding function . How is this iCloud thing any different?
    Lots of message history won't take up device storage and instead on iCloud depending on who you frequent and who you don't. Threads are also synced. So if you delete a thread with Darren A. on your iPad the thread is also deleted on your iPhone.

    Edit: If you go to 12:42 of the video I linked, Rene gives you much better detail.

    https://twit.tv/shows/macbreak-weekl...utostart=false
    Last edited by BreakingKayfabe; 05-31-2018 at 07:36 AM.
    05-30-2018 12:51 PM
  10. doogald's Avatar
    I had my iMessages synchronized on my iPhone and iPad way before this update with the message forwarding function . How is this iCloud thing any different?
    If you set up a device as new, going forward with iMessage in iCloud, it will also have all of the message history.
    05-30-2018 02:42 PM
  11. gnirkatto's Avatar
    Lots of message history won't take up device storage and instead on iCloud depending on who you frequent and who you don't. Threads are also synced. So if you delete a thread with Darren A. on your iPad the thread is also deleted on your iPhone.

    Edit: If you go to 10:42 of the video I linked, Rene gives you much better detail.

    https://twit.tv/shows/macbreak-weekl...utostart=false
    I think it starts at 12:42 not 10:42.
    However, I didn't get much detail out of it - "I haven't tried this out yet, but it should do this or that...." ?

    So to wrap it up, here are the findings that I made so far:

    • new iCloud support for iMessage has to be turned on first on iOS devices under settings->name->iCloud
    • then, all message history that is still on the device, will be uploaded to iCloud, the next time the device is on WiFi and on charger. Apparently, for subsequent syncs, the device doesn't have to be on charger.
    • however, these older messages do not appear on other iOs devices after sync. So still unclear to me, what this is good for.
    • New messages will appear on other iOS devices rather quickly. Also on the Mac, although there was no update on 'messages' yet, afaik. And, I believe, they already appeared there before the iOS update.
    • Messages that were deleted on one iOS device will delete instantly also on other iOS devices. NOT so on the Mac !!??!! -> is this what the next Mac OS update will provide?



    So basically, I appreciate new messages getting synced from now on. But why not older ones, as they're getting uploaded anyway?
    Deletion of a message on all iOS devices is a good thing. Mac not (yet?) being included is bad.
    In general, the new feature seems to be a subset of what other messengers like eg Telegram have been doing since quite some time now, with the addition of supporting almost all platforms that are out there, while iMessage still does iOS and (partly) Mac only.
    05-31-2018 04:42 AM
  12. robertk328's Avatar
    I had my iMessages synchronized on my iPhone and iPad way before this update with the message forwarding function . How is this iCloud thing any different?
    Post 4, 9, etc.
    05-31-2018 04:48 AM
  13. gnirkatto's Avatar
    P.S. some people claim, that if I start over with a new iOS device, all these previously uploaded messages will appear. As I'm doing that once a year only, after buying a new iPhone or iPad, I can't verify that. So in an existing productive environment, this initial upload feature adds no value. Also, I do not entirely understand why it was not possible to sync this message history back to other devices. Technically, I don't see the problem, but who really knows?
    05-31-2018 04:51 AM
  14. doogald's Avatar
    however, these older messages do not appear on other iOs devices after sync. So still unclear to me, what this is good for.
    In March I was running the 11.3 beta on my phone (which had iMessage in iCloud) specifically for this reason. I upgraded to a new iPhone X, set it up as new with the 11.3 beta, turned on iMessage in iCloud, and found all of my message history sync down to my phone.

    I just checked my iPad, which was set up as new in January, and it has history only back to December, so it's possible for existing devices that not all messages get synced across. I'm not sure, I haven't seen any technical support pages about this from Apple yet.

    Anyway, for new devices, it worked back then. I don't know about now.

    Messages that were deleted on one iOS device will delete instantly also on other iOS devices. NOT so on the Mac !!??!! -> is this what the next Mac OS update will provide?
    It's my understanding that 10.13.5 will bring iMessage in iCloud. It must be being held up, since they've already released 10.13.6 beta. I suspect that Apple expected to released the latest High Sierra two days ago but something is holding it up.
    05-31-2018 05:37 AM
  15. BreakingKayfabe's Avatar
    P.S. some people claim, that if I start over with a new iOS device, all these previously uploaded messages will appear.
    Add me to the list of people who claim this. For the first time in a number of years I have restored my iPhones as new. Both an 8 Plus and X. Messages downloaded fine. I have messages that go as far back as May 2016 and they are right there.
    doogald likes this.
    05-31-2018 07:27 AM
  16. BreakingKayfabe's Avatar
    I think it starts at 12:42 not 10:42.
    However, I didn't get much detail out of it - "I haven't tried this out yet, but it should do this or that...."
    Yes, 12:42, my mistake. And he explained it in great detail.
    05-31-2018 07:29 AM
  17. BreakingKayfabe's Avatar
    By the way for those of you who have turned it on and are expecting messages to be merged, uploaded and downloaded within minutes: give it a day or two for everything to sync up. That was my experience when messages on iCloud first was on the 11.3 betas. Patience.
    doogald likes this.
    05-31-2018 07:31 AM
  18. gnirkatto's Avatar
    It's my understanding that 10.13.5 will bring iMessage in iCloud. It must be being held up, since they've already released 10.13.6 beta. I suspect that Apple expected to released the latest High Sierra two days ago but something is holding it up.
    But new messages do/did sync already with the Mac. So there has to be some cloud hocus pocus going on already. Maybe not through iCloud though.
    05-31-2018 07:33 AM
  19. gnirkatto's Avatar
    Yes, 12:42, my mistake. And he explained it in great detail.
    Actually not. The very fist thing he said was that he had not even flipped the switch yet to turn on iCloud. So the rest sounded like speculation to me, not based on experiences made or firm knowledge.
    But anyway, it doesn’t really matter. I did not get enlightened, others did. Fine.
    05-31-2018 07:39 AM
  20. BreakingKayfabe's Avatar
    Actually not. The very fist thing he said was that he had not even flipped the switch yet to turn on iCloud. So the rest sounded like speculation to me, not based on experiences made or firm knowledge.
    But anyway, it doesn’t really matter. I did not get enlightened, others did. Fine.
    That was indeed not the very first thing he said. He explained it thoroughly and said he had it going since the betas.

    It’s better that you’re not enlightened though. It’s much better for people like yourself who don’t understand it even with great explanation to keep it off. Thanks.
    05-31-2018 08:29 AM
  21. BreakingKayfabe's Avatar
    But new messages do/did sync already with the Mac. So there has to be some cloud hocus pocus going on already. Maybe not through iCloud though.
    So “cloud hocus pocus” that is “not through iCloud”. Talk about speculation and conjecture.

    It’s device by device before 11.4 which is also explained by Rene in the video I provided. That is actual fact. You don’t even need him to explain it. The information is out there if you take the time to actually research it. You shouldn’t come ask amateurs on a forum to do your library research if their explanations don’t work for you.
    05-31-2018 08:41 AM
  22. doogald's Avatar
    But new messages do/did sync already with the Mac. So there has to be some cloud hocus pocus going on already. Maybe not through iCloud though.
    Not on my Mac. I go back and forth with iMessage on the Mac, turning it on when I want to send messages and off because I don't want to use the Mac as a message machine otherwise, so my message store on the Mac is a gobbledy-gook of what is on my iPhone and iPad.
    05-31-2018 09:50 AM
  23. igorsky's Avatar
    Personally, Messages in iCloud has no value until watchOS is added to it.
    05-31-2018 01:45 PM
  24. gnirkatto's Avatar
    That was indeed not the very first thing he said. He explained it thoroughly and said he had it going since the betas.

    It’s better that you’re not enlightened though. It’s much better for people like yourself who don’t understand it even with great explanation to keep it off. Thanks.
    „So if I turn this switch on....?“
    „I haven’t actually tried that, but what it should do is.....“.

    Great explanation, based upon guessing what it is. At the time when I watched this video, even someone like myself already had tried and figured out what the switch did. Thanks.
    05-31-2018 01:45 PM
  25. Sherry_B's Avatar
    P.S. why have these *#&% IT companies stopped explaining clearly how their new features work ?
    I don't know about other companies, but Apple hasn't.

    https://itunes.apple.com/us/book/iph...mUvbUpU3065881
    06-01-2018 12:14 PM
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