Using the stock app, my watch consistently shows a slower pace than what my treadmill shows. Calibration shouldn't be the problem because I've got many outside runs.
What running app do you use? Why?
- Thread starter tcuprof
- Start date
Using the stock app, my watch consistently shows a slower pace than what my treadmill shows. Calibration shouldn't be the problem because I've got many outside runs.
Well that's disappointing. I assume in the closed Apple ecosystem, there's no way to manually change that eh?
StraightlineBoy
Well-known member
What's to say the treadmill is spot on - they have a margin of error too. Ultimately running on a treadmill is different to running outside, both in terms of the surface and the action required, so your stride might be different on both. With or without calibration I think it's fairly unreasonable to expect any wrist based device to be consistent with a random treadmill. 30s in just over 8 minutes is only just over 5% anyway. I think you're expecting too much.
eyecrispy
iPhone 7, iPad Pro & Apple Watch Champion
My AW usually shows a faster pace than the treadmill. I think it's bc my turnover is high. If you've got a short, fast stride, the watch will think you're covering more "ground".
I've been running on a treadmill with various devices for quite some time with multiple devices so I'm well aware of the challenges. With the MS Band, it pretty much always took the average pace of my last run regardless of what the treadmill showed. For example, if my last outdoor run was 7:45 and I set the treadmill to 8:00, the Band showed 7:45 (+/- a few seconds). As I pointed out, my average pace on my only two outdoor runs with the Watch was around 8:10. I would have expected the Watch to show about an 8:10 pace pretty much regardless of the treadmill setting. It was off from that by over 20 seconds. From a distance tracking perspective, that was .25 of a mile over a 3 mile run. That's simply not good. Expanding that to a 10 mile run (yes, I do those on a treadmill sometimes), that's going to be nearly a full mile off. As you said, it won't be consistent with the treadmill, but it should be consistent with the calibration of the watch to my stride.
Does anyone know if the watch use GPS calibration (likely through the phone) even when just walking? I do a fair amount of walking to get to work so if it then incorporates that into my runs, that would explain why it would be slower. I guess I'll leave the calibration setting on for my next outdoor run and then turn it off so that it shouldn't have the option of using my walking.
True, the treadmill could be inaccurate and stride could also be different. Still, I've observed the watch reporting a slower pace and less distance on three different treadmills. Also, I tend to run at a very consistent pace and I just think I'd know if I were running 30-45 seconds per mile slower.
Mac Guy
Well-known member
According to Apple, you can calibrate an S2 Watch while walking or running. If you don't have anS2, you'd need to use your iPhone and calibrate it instead.
If you have an S2 and walk or run with your phone, you'd probably calibrate the phone first, then put it in Airplane mode and let the S2 use it's own GPS instead of the phone's. I believe you're calibrating the accelerometer to your normal walk or run pace, against the GPS, and not calibrating the GPS itself. I think you can reset the calibration for both the Watch and the phone, if you feel the need...
I ran an experiment similar to this. I reset the calibration on the Watch and then I went for a run that averaged right at the 8:00 mark (4.01 miles in 32:08). Then I turned off calibration (privacy->location services->System Services->motion calibration & distance). My hypothesis here was that the calibration was actually including my walking into it's calculations. I personally don't care if my walking distances are accurate so this is OK with me. I ran 3 miles on the treadmill today - 8:10, 8:10, and 8:00 miles. So this, to me, was within my expected margin of error (treadmill accuracy and potentially different stride length on it). Obviously, I'm only one data point here, but I think this certainly supports my hypothesis.
Interesting. I haven't recalibrated but I decided to see how my AW2 did on a treadmill walk since on the treadmill I've only ever used it for runs. For my morning walks this week, I set the treadmill to the usual speed of 15 min/mile. The workout app is reporting the pace at 14'41", 14'46", and 14'35". I suppose given possible differences in stride length, that could be accurate. If so, it makes me think the margin of error goes up as you speed up.
eyecrispy
iPhone 7, iPad Pro & Apple Watch Champion
Interesting. What does turning that setting off on your phone do to your watch? Mine is toggled on, but when I'm running on a treadmill, my phone is sitting on the treadmill and not on my person. I guess I'm just saying that I don't know what that setting actually does.
My understanding is that is correlates the watch's movement with the GPS. With this off, neither the watch nor the phone itself will continue to try to keep the calibration updated whether walking or running.
Unrelated question for people using the Nike app: It seems that every time I start a run, my first mile is off by about .1 of a mile. When I run past my normal mile marks (multiple routes), I consistently pass them before the watch hits the mile marker. After that, it seems to be accurate (albeit behind by .1 miles), but that first mile is always off. I think I'm going to try starting a run and then immediately hitting pause for a bit to give the GPS time to actually kick in. It seems like the map is accurate after the fact, but something's not quite right.
Updating my thoughts here: don't follow my instructions. I went for a run today on a route that I know is 4.3 miles. I was running harder than normal and my miles were all off. With the Motion and Tracking turned off, I think it doesn't allow the GPS to actually calculate the distance it will only use the steps (which had previously calibrated to 8:00). The map was accurate, but the distance was off. Because I was running faster than normal I was covering more distance with the same number of steps.
matt3166
Well-known member
I'm running into similar issues with tracking and can't figure out what's more accurate. I went on a 4 and half mile run using the workout app and it saying I burned 489 total calories. A couple days later I did another same route and distance using runtastic and it says 634 total calories.
I know pace etc can make a difference but I doubt almost 200 more calories difference.
I know pace etc can make a difference but I doubt almost 200 more calories difference.
Matt, what are the average heart rates for those two runs? The higher calorie count on the second run is probably due to a higher average heart rate, which may or may not have been accurate.
I have a question for those not using the stock Apple running app -- What changes in the running app would get you to switch from the 3rd party app you're using now? What are the most important features that are missing?
- (*) interval support with haptics (not sound) at interval distance/time
- (*) GPS lock indication (I'll wait until it's got a lock)
- (*) option to turn off countdown
- option to use buttons for stop/start and lap
- choose data to show on the watch face(s) (time, lap time, distance, lap distance, current pace, average pace, etc.)
- (*) data export/upload to external services like Garmin connect, Strava, Nike, etc.
I don't need all of these, but at least the ones with (*)
mumfoau
Ambassador
Running? What's running?
I think it's that you do when someone is chasing you with a weapon of some sort.
mumfoau
Ambassador
Oh yeah, that I'm familiar with and in that case my app of choice is the phone app to dial 911
eyecrispy
iPhone 7, iPad Pro & Apple Watch Champion
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