- 12-01-2009, 11:06 AM #26
I fully agree with you Blink... But when one peppers their arguement with falsehoods, Lies, deceit and personal attacks on those that He doesn't agree with, it NULLIFIES their position. I suggest to Everyone who has been following this conversation go back and RE-READ EACH of WHM's comments... I'm NOT debating his Education nor his Expertise in the "Cyber Security" area NOR am I denying there is a "Security Issue". I AM Debating his General Blanketing of "ALL Jail Breakers" as "Rogues, Thugs, Naifs, Members of the Underworld living in the same Community". For THAT I take offence. Yet he FAILS to acknowledge he to lives within that SAME Community, as pointed out by another in this thread. Thereby placing himself, in his mind, ABOVE the "Rogues, Thugs, Naifs and Jail Breakers". WHM is "GIFTED" in his usage of the English Vocabulary. Quoting another FAMOUS Socialist..." JUST Words, JUST speeches"... It's amazing the power of the tongue... Pepper your speech with truth and falsehood and you can sell one a worthless bill of goods or even buy a man's soul without his knowledge of what just happened.
- 12-01-2009, 11:29 AM #27iPhone Beginner
- 55 Posts
The entire purpose of this sub-forum is to help people with Jailbreaking and to discuss the intricacies of it. So isn't this forum in essence helping the entire AT&T/iPhone society by increasing the security and helping those who may be as WHM classifies them 'weak systems'? Essentially, we are the good guys of the jailbreakers, those with the knowledge and/or desire to learn more about the phones so that we are not susceptible to future exploits, and that we can assist others in becoming safe from them as well.
For the record, I got my first iPhone one week ago today, and I have been jailbroken for 2 days. I guess reading makes me some kind of expert?
WHM, you say that there are unknown vulnerabilities out there for Jailbroken iPhones, but if they are so completely unknown, is it not true that there are also likely vulnerabilities for normal iPhones? As IGoSlo put it, it's a personal responsibility thing. If you jailbrak your phone, it allows you to do things that could lead you open to an attack. And if your phone is attacked it could lead to other people (who also didn't take the proper steps) being attacked. Basically, the only people who are being attacked are those who did not take responsibilty for their actions (learning about jailbreaking before doing it)
You need to step back a little and look and your position to understand why perhaps you are at odds with so many of us here. You are paid to deal with security exploits, and deal with systems that are not secure and have been attacked. Therefore, all you see all day long is harmful people taking advantage of weak systems. This causes you to have a skewed perspective of how pervasive the exploits are. I know someone who works with Western Digital (and previously with Seagate) repairing damaged and failed hard drives. As a result, she doesn't trust most drives because of the sheer number of failed drives she sees at work. However, in reality the failure rate of most modern drives is actually quite low.
If you have anything to add as to how we can make our jailbroken iPhones more secure and less vulnerable to attacks, I'm all ears. If not, you can go back to your job which pays so well instead of spending your time here for free.
- 12-01-2009, 11:30 AM #28
As with any debate thread, I have been watching this one closely and this one has remained civil enough. However, I must point out that not once did whmurray ever say that all jailbreakers are "rogues, thugs, naifs". This, in fact, is what he said
You become part of a population that includes the rogues, thugs, bullies, and naifs.
I was very careful not to group all jailbreakers with "rogues, thugs, and bullies" but simply pointed out that by jailbreaking one includes oneself in a population that they occupy.
Let me be clear that I am not choosing sides on this matter (there are things I agree and disagree about both arguments) but just felt I needed to point this out since some are taking personal offense to a misunderstanding.
- 12-01-2009, 12:55 PM #29
Parsing of words...It Depends what the "Definition" of is... "is"... whmurray stated and I Quote..." When one Jail Breaks "ONE BECOMES PART" of a COMMUNITY of Rogues, thugs, bullies and naifs". Now, he is either stating Jail Breakers are a community within a community or they "BECOME" LIKE the Community they have chosen to acquaint themselves with... He Can not have it BOTH ways... He uses the word "BECOME"..."to enter into or assume a certain state or condition". That my friends, is WHAT I TAKE OFFENCE with... whmurray has NEVER had a relationship me nor would he recognize me on the street. Yet he passes JUDGEMENT?
And YES he has passed JUDGEMENT... With his opening statement he passed JUDGEMENT on ALL Jailbreakers... Again... "Just Words... Just Speeches"... String enough of them together and one can sell a BOX of Rocks... His Logic into the jailbreaking community holds no value... it's ALL based on HIS false assumetions as to whom we are as individuals Yet most likely I'm NOT the only Jail Breaker he knows very little about... As with this and other Forums, not all members are on the same page or serve the same agenda. Does that make us like the "DECEIVER"? I think not. In this world, just as in whmurray's world there are those who have HONEST Hearts and those that DON'T... Both world's not only have individual Rights and FREEDOMS, They BOTH Have a responsibility to protect, EDUCATE and strenghten their members... WHM, I wish you peace knowing that YOU have NOT been called to POLICE my world
- 12-01-2009, 01:07 PM #30
- 12-01-2009, 04:40 PM #31iPhone Newbie
- 33 Posts
Non-jailbroken phones aren't immune from risks either. Wasn't there something recently about an app sending phone numbers without user's consent? So one "issue" has been identified for jailbroken phones as well as non-jailbroken phones. 1 to 1.
If everyone always stayed with a platform that offered "security" in exchange for restrictions, technology wouldn't be where it is today. The reason we've made it this far is because of people who weren't happy with the current offerings and decided to create something they thought was better.
Sure, with any new technology, new method, or with any advancement there is risks. But should we as a society stop trying to improve things because we're afraid of unknown risks?
And besides, there are plenty of phone platforms out there that are more open and more "vulnerable" but they do as jailbrakers do. They identify vulnerability and patch it.
It's the nature of the beast we call "advancement".
- 12-01-2009, 06:11 PM #32
- 12-01-2009, 07:00 PM #33
- 12-01-2009, 07:23 PM #34
- 12-01-2009, 10:55 PM #35
- 12-02-2009, 01:34 AM #36
- 12-02-2009, 08:00 AM #37
- 12-02-2009, 08:03 AM #38