So how exactly is Apple losing marketshare to Google's Android platform?

Just_Me_D

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No, it is not ignorance, it is plain fact there model isn't sustainable long term,
Explain.
high market is getting saturated.
Okay, but you're not taking into account customer loyalty. There are some people who will only buy Apple, Samsung, HTC, Blackberry, or Windows mobile, etcetera. Saturation won't have any effect on that.
There are over 7 billion people in the world, only a little over a 1 billion have access to smart phones, you have to make a device for the next billion or else you are going be waiting for the person who already has the latest and greatest to go out and buy again soon.
You're assuming that 7 billion people own a smartphone when that is not the case. You're also assuming that all of those people will want an iPhone, and that, too, is not the case.

It works now, I think in maybe 5 years they will have to adjust. And at the same time, of course cheaper phones equal smaller profit margins but what company can better take that risk than Apple?
Just because they can does not mean they should.
I think your argument stems from and quite a few arguments stem from that you are worried about the brand getting diluted which is just what you think people view your electronics as and believe me no one will care less.
Okay

If you have high end, you have high end iPhones to enjoy for those who want the cheaper iOS experience they can have it. Every other OS does this, yet all of sudden it hurts Apple because, reasons? Weird.

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Some people do not want to accept that Apple products are considered "high end", "top quality", etcetera. Whether they like it or not, that image has served and continues to serve Apple well. It is one of the things that separate them from its competitors. That's a good thing. Apple is one of the most profitable companies on the planet and has been for a while now. Some even claim that Apple has "too much money", yet, still offer suggestions on how it can "maximize" it profits by offering low end devices. Apple's target market is intact and increasing as-is.
 

anon(4698833)

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Actually that isn't my personality at all, what is your problem? I have no clue what brought on this tirade you have, but it is not becoming. It is just an idea, we use forums to discuss ideas and get help. I discussed an idea, but you are using my idea as an indication of my own personality, which I don't understand at all.

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You want to know what my problem is? You strolling into my thread trying to make it seem like anyone who defends the idea that Apple is serving the market just as they desire by maintaining the brand identity that made them what they are today and telling me (and anyone else that said it) that we are wrong and that Apple needs to venture into the entry level world to retain relevance.

You know why I have a problem with you telling me this? Because you're NOT just sharing an idea...you're critically moving that existing fact is wrong, and that your "idea" is some kind of accurate layout of the future...when in reality, you have an opinion on the matter that is about as legitimate as viewing into a magic 8 ball and asking "Should Apple start making entry level products?"

My problem further reflects the idea that the spectrum of consumer deserves to have the ability to buy what I enjoy...I mean really? I enjoy Apple products for a multitude of reasons, most of which revolve around their usability in my day to day activities and world. A part of it, though, reflects the feeling that I am getting an upper epsilon product...one that stands out as a better built, feature rich and less "cookie cutter" generic product. I don't want to see this company selling iPhone's that are lesser built/developed/spec'ed for the sake of making sure every Tom, **** and Harry can afford one, even if they're ability resides in a more budget friendly platform. Android handles this...they do it well...yet for some reason you feel that Apple should venture into this consumer environment, with a disregard for Apple's product image, simply because you feel there's more MONEY to be had there.

If every company that followed a similar business model as Apple thought what you said was the optimal route...we'd end up with like a handful of companies on the planet in the end TOTAL...conglomerate companies that care little about image, quality or customer experience, and focus on MONEY. Thank GOD there are companies in the world that find that approach juvenile, boring and unworthy...and thankfully Apple is one of them.

That is my problem with your posts here (and it's not just you, you share the stage with a few more too). You don't understand why I'm attacking your ideas because you don't understand why they sound so asinine. You just don't understand...but you represent your words like we don't understand.
 

cbobb123

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Why does it seem like many who disagree with Apple can't do so without getting emotional and throwing out hyperboles? If everyone didn't bash down someone's idea about how Apple can improve and pretend the can do no wrong, this place would be much calmer. After all, if Apple is really causing that much emotional strife in someone's life, they should cut Apple out of their lives.
 

Flow39

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disregard for Apple's product image, simply because you feel there's more MONEY to be had there.

If every company that followed a similar business model as Apple thought what you said was the optimal route...we'd end up with like a handful of companies on the planet in the end TOTAL...conglomerate companies that care little about image, quality or customer experience, and focus on MONEY.

Even Steve Jobs said something related to this. He said something along the lines of if you're in it for the money, your product won't succeed. You have to want to produce the best products, which will then lead to money, not the other way around.
 

anon(4698833)

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Why does it seem like many who disagree with Apple can't do so without getting emotional and throwing out hyperboles? If everyone didn't bash down someone's idea about how Apple can improve and pretend the can do no wrong, this place would be much calmer. After all, if Apple is really causing that much emotional strife in someone's life, they should cut Apple out of their lives.

Look out guys! We have a heavy weight here! I'm still waiting for someone to show me where anyone in the history of this website/forum has ever said Apple can do no wrong. It seems to evade every person who presents it as being a problem...and can't show where it was actually done.
 

Just_Me_D

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Why does it seem like many who disagree with Apple can't do so without getting emotional and throwing out hyperboles? If everyone didn't bash down someone's idea about how Apple can improve and pretend the can do no wrong, this place would be much calmer. After all, if Apple is really causing that much emotional strife in someone's life, they should cut Apple out of their lives.

Let me summarize the replies. Ideas, opinions and even disagreeing views are welcomed here at iMore. Having said that, don't expect your idea, opinion or disagreement to go unchallenged if it does not make sense, is presented as fact or you yourself get offended when it is debunked.
 

Derrick4Real

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This is common knowledge. It's obvious that Android sells lots of phones because they are cheaper and more affordable. I know tons of people that don't visit blogs about phones and buy a phone that's affordable. Not to mention they have a ton more form factor and feature options. Most people in my family have had multiple android phones. Many come free. Only two people in my family (8 people) have had an iphone. Of course they sell more phones.

As for should Apple be worried? It's a competitor. It be foolish to not have concern. Microsoft controlled the pc market for decades by offering a cheaper solution by licensing their software. Android is doing the same. I should be a concern. But there is a big difference in that once when a company chooses Windows platform for PC you can't just easily and cheaply change because you have to rebuy all the software and retrain a workforce. Also if you rely on PC only software you can't switch everybody. Phones, people aren't as locked into the the app software on the device. If you want twitter you can find a similar twitter app on all platforms. So i don't think it's entirely analogous. But If you're ever losing marketshare globally a company should be paying attention.
 

Tre Lawrence

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This is common knowledge. It's obvious that Android sells lots of phones because they are cheaper and more affordable. I know tons of people that don't visit blogs about phones and buy a phone that's affordable. Not to mention they have a ton more form factor and feature options. Most people in my family have had multiple android phones. Many come free. Only two people in my family (8 people) have had an iphone. Of course they sell more phones.

As for should Apple be worried? It's a competitor. It be foolish to not have concern. Microsoft controlled the pc market for decades by offering a cheaper solution by licensing their software. Android is doing the same. I should be a concern. But there is a big difference in that once when a company chooses Windows platform for PC you can't just easily and cheaply change because you have to rebuy all the software and retrain a workforce. Also if you rely on PC only software you can't switch everybody. Phones, people aren't as locked into the the app software on the device. If you want twitter you can find a similar twitter app on all platforms. So i don't think it's entirely analogous. But If you're ever losing marketshare globally a company should be paying attention.

Can't disagree with this.
 

anon(4698833)

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This is common knowledge. It's obvious that Android sells lots of phones because they are cheaper and more affordable. I know tons of people that don't visit blogs about phones and buy a phone that's affordable. Not to mention they have a ton more form factor and feature options. Most people in my family have had multiple android phones. Many come free. Only two people in my family (8 people) have had an iphone. Of course they sell more phones.

As for should Apple be worried? It's a competitor. It be foolish to not have concern. Microsoft controlled the pc market for decades by offering a cheaper solution by licensing their software. Android is doing the same. I should be a concern. But there is a big difference in that once when a company chooses Windows platform for PC you can't just easily and cheaply change because you have to rebuy all the software and retrain a workforce. Also if you rely on PC only software you can't switch everybody. Phones, people aren't as locked into the the app software on the device. If you want twitter you can find a similar twitter app on all platforms. So i don't think it's entirely analogous. But If you're ever losing marketshare globally a company should be paying attention.

Except once again you can't lose something you never have (or more appropriately, never participated in). Apple doesn't venture into the entry level market, where Android thrives and where google makes MOST of it's money off the OS. It's like trying to say that Tesla should be concerned with the marketshare GM has on the compact car market. It simply isn't relevant. I know tons of people who buy compact cars, what difference does it make? None.

Your Microsoft analogy doesn't work because Microsoft WAS/IS the general spectrum PC maker...in fact, in terms of this discussion, its pretty much the opposite, and would speak more towards Samsung's potential concerns about Apple's movement in the market. Microsoft commanded the market of PC's across the spectrum, until someone came in and brought a luxury line of PC's that took over that consumer base. The same is true with the iPhone and Apple, only they have maintained that dominance since the first true breath of smart phones.
 

Speedygi

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Except once again you can't lose something you never have (or more appropriately, never participated in). Apple doesn't venture into the entry level market, where Android thrives and where google makes MOST of it's money off the OS. It's like trying to say that Tesla should be concerned with the marketshare GM has on the compact car market. It simply isn't relevant. I know tons of people who buy compact cars, what difference does it make? None.

Your Microsoft analogy doesn't work because Microsoft WAS/IS the general spectrum PC maker...in fact, in terms of this discussion, its pretty much the opposite, and would speak more towards Samsung's potential concerns about Apple's movement in the market. Microsoft commanded the market of PC's across the spectrum, until someone came in and brought a luxury line of PC's that took over that consumer base. The same is true with the iPhone and Apple, only they have maintained that dominance since the first true breath of smart phones.
Android has its presence on "high end devices" since the beginning too, it's not like it's always entry level all the way, and some of these devices, in some ways, even has the same or higher level of production levels that Apple has put into its devices. Motorola has had seen rising marketshare and profits, while offering a more diverse Phone range, and no one ever accuses Motorola of being cheap. I don't see how Apple can't do the same.

Unless most of the fans disagree, of course.
 

anon(4698833)

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Android has its presence on "high end devices" since the beginning too, it's not like it's always entry level all the way, and some of these devices, in some ways, even has the same or higher level of production levels that Apple has put into its devices. Motorola has had seen rising marketshare and profits, while offering a more diverse Phone range, and no one ever accuses Motorola of being cheap. I don't see how Apple can't do the same.

Unless most of the fans disagree, of course.

Except Android didn't even come into existence until more than a year after the iPhone's release...and then even further out with phones that were actual competitors for the iPhone (Galaxy line, Nexus, etc). The first Android devices were not high end offerings...not by a long shot.

To be 100% honest, I don't have any idea what point you're trying to make...who said anything about build quality of the phones offered now vs. the iPhone on the high end? The discussion isn't really relevant at all to this post.

Also, Motorola's offerings are not competitive on any level to the iPhone in terms of what this discussion is about.
 

BreakingKayfabe

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Speaking of high-end phones, I don't find any Android phones on the market right now to be "high-end" when compared to the iPhone. HTC, Samsung, LG, etc. None of them. Each of those manufacturers have their own high-end devices as compared to all the other Android phones each of those companies make. Fact of the matter is that Apple basically makes 3 different iPhones in the U.S. They still offer the 4S, the 5C, and the 5S. The build quality (since we're on the subject of that also) on each those phones is top-notch. Why do you think there is hardly ever any spectacle around the time of a release of certain Android phones? The freaken iPhone rumors are making it on TMZ now. Do you realize that the 5S will be more usable in 2017 than the HTC One M8? I would bet my house that the 5S would be able to use features of iOS 11 than the 4S is able to use for iOS 8. Talk about high-end. I'm just scrambling all over the place with this now, but I'm sure most of you get my point here.
 

Tre Lawrence

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Speaking of high-end phones, I don't find any Android phones on the market right now to be "high-end" when compared to the iPhone.

LOL, to be fair, I'd expect for iPhone enthusiasts to think only the iPhone is high end. I've heard Android, BBRY folks and WP8 users say the same about their devices.

I'm way looser. I'd say Android has several, and BBRY has at least two, and WP8 has a few.

Depends on one's perspective, I guess.
 

Derrick4Real

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Except once again you can't lose something you never have (or more appropriately, never participated in). Apple doesn't venture into the entry level market, where Android thrives and where google makes MOST of it's money off the OS. It's like trying to say that Tesla should be concerned with the marketshare GM has on the compact car market. It simply isn't relevant. I know tons of people who buy compact cars, what difference does it make? None.

Your Microsoft analogy doesn't work because Microsoft WAS/IS the general spectrum PC maker...in fact, in terms of this discussion, its pretty much the opposite, and would speak more towards Samsung's potential concerns about Apple's movement in the market. Microsoft commanded the market of PC's across the spectrum, until someone came in and brought a luxury line of PC's that took over that consumer base. The same is true with the iPhone and Apple, only they have maintained that dominance since the first true breath of smart phones.

Apple did have some market share. You're losing that. Apple didn't have ZERO market share. They had some market share. Globally it has seen a decline and thus they are losing market share.

And saying apple does or doesn't venture into the entry level market doesn't change that in places in the world people are buying more android phones. But it's also wrong. The $99 iphone is an entry level phone, the iphone c is entry level. Hell if you remotely try hard you can find and new iphone with scant memory for free on contract just like lots of entry level phones.

Cars and PC markets are simply not similar. There are many more players, product choice, and less dominant players. Not to mention you can easily switch car makers if you know how to drive. If you run a pharmaceutical company, that has in house coders that wrote proprietary software for windows to run 4 year R&D programs you're not just switching to Linux or OSX no matter what. And if you don't think Tesla is trying to take market share from bigger auto players you're naive.

Microsoft was a software company not a pc maker. Apple makes pcs and software. IBM was the company Microsoft contracted with to make PCs and offer Windows as a Dos GUI. My point is about how software ties people to a platform and did. And you conveniently ignored my statement that "i don't think it's entirely analogous."

I'm talking about software. Bottom line is Microsoft came in, licensed their OS cheaply, and dominated the PC market while Apple refused, priced their product very high, and got slaughtered on market share almost bankrupting the company. Those are facts. But again i said it's not entirely analogous so it seems strange to attack me based on something i've admitted already in the text.Even so you're attack is misguided. This is a discussion about android, an operating system, not a single manufacturer so you can't confine it to simply Samsung. Samsung can leave the phone market and there will still be tons of android phones to buy.
 

Just_Me_D

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LOL, to be fair, I'd expect for iPhone enthusiasts to think only the iPhone is high end. I've heard Android, BBRY folks and WP8 users say the same about their devices.

I'm way looser. I'd say Android has several, and BBRY has at least two, and WP8 has a few.

Depends on one's perspective, I guess.

I am an iPhone enthusiast who has had mobile phones dating back to 1989. Having said that, If Apple only makes high end iPhones, wouldn't anyone come to the conclusion that only the iPhone is high end? Think about it. There are so many Android devices and the manufacture and the OS can be different on each one. The same can be said of build quality, and to compare each one to the iPhone is silly, in my opinion. That is NOT saying that HTC, Motorola or Samsung does not make quality devices because they do, but when you clump Android as a whole, well....:)
 

Just_Me_D

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Boom. This. Which is what most of these threads boil down to. My phone brand of choice is better than you pissing contests.

Many threads do boil down to this, unfortunately, but seriously, let's be real for a moment. This is iMore, a predominantly Apple based tech forum. We've all witnessed people who venture into this Apple-centric forum to show us that a specific non-Apple smartphone is better than the iPhone and create their thread in the form of a "what do you think of the ....?" question. Then it turns into a mine is better than yours thread, and then they try to justify it by saying, "I, too, own Apple products"....;)
 
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Tre Lawrence

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I am an iPhone enthusiast who has had mobile phones dating back to 1989. Having said that, If Apple only makes high end iPhones, wouldn't anyone come to the conclusion that only the iPhone is high end? Think about it. There are so many Android devices and the manufacture and the OS can be different on each one. The same can be said of build quality, and to compare each one to the iPhone is silly, in my opinion. That is NOT saying that HTC, Motorola or Samsung does not make quality devices because they do, but when you clump Android as a whole, well....:)

...but to say only Apple makes premium devices?

It's an interesting perspective, but as I noted, one that isn't only restricted to just iMore.
 

BreakingKayfabe

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LOL, to be fair, I'd expect for iPhone enthusiasts to think only the iPhone is high end. I've heard Android, BBRY folks and WP8 users say the same about their devices.

I'm way looser. I'd say Android has several, and BBRY has at least two, and WP8 has a few.

Depends on one's perspective, I guess.

I said the high-end Android devices were of those that compared to Android and not the iPhone. It is based on perspective and my perspective is that of the fact that an iPhone IS premium because it doesn't come with a ton of brethren (lower end iPhones).

Boom. This. Which is what most of these threads boil down to. My phone brand of choice is better than you pissing contests.

That's how you see it. I'm replying to you on my Note 3. I don't have a brand loyalty but I have preferablitiy when it comes to things. I honestly think that the iPhone and its build quality along with its usability far outweighs the Android competitors.

...but to say only Apple makes premium devices?

It's an interesting perspective, but as I noted, one that isn't only restricted to just iMore.

So if it's not only restricted to an Apple enthusiast site, then what does that tell you? lol
 

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